Kaisha: All right.

It's Thursday at 4:20 PM.

Eastern.

That means it's time for office hours.

Roy's weekly session for cultivators
to hear from the experts and

talk to each other about what
they're seeing with their grows.

My name is Kaisha, and I'll be co
today with my good friend, Mandy.

What's up?

How you doing Mandy?

Hey, Kaisha.

So psyched to be here for episode 39.

Uh, we're also going live over on YouTube.

I'll be monitoring for
your questions over there.

So don't be afraid to go ahead and
send them on over, uh, be sure you're

following us on Instagram and TikTok.

If you haven't.

You guys know how we do it.

So let's go ahead and get to those
crop steering questions we got

this week back to you, Kaisha.

Awesome.

Thank you, Mandy.

And yeah, if you're alive with us here
and have a question type it in the chat

at any time, your question gets picked.

We're gonna either, have
you unmute yourself or I can

ask for you, Seth and Jason.

How's it going over there?

Good.

Kaisha, how about yourself doing good.

It was nice to see you last week.

Um, you ready for our first
question from Instagram?

We got a bunch this week.

We're so excited.

It's

Jason: not wasting any time.

Kaisha: dude, I like that.

All right.

So someone wrote this in first and
foremost, thank you to everyone, aro

for the wealth of information than the
professional setting, to learn and gain a

better understanding of plant physiology.

My question is as the industry
and home growers move toward full

spectrum LEDs, could you dive deeper
into the role of RuBisCO in carbon

fixation and the increased grow room
temperatures you would recommend.

What do you guys think about that?

Jason: Sure.

Uh, so let's just talk a
little bit about RuBisCO.

Uh, I'm no plant biologist here,
but it is one of the first major.

Steps, uh, it's the enzyme in
creating the sugars that plants used.

So it's a carbon fixer that happens
inside the plant before we get to ATP.

Um, as far as when we talk about
LEDs, I'm, I'm not sure I'm

qualified to deep dive right into
the science of, uh, Resco production

itself in relationship to the LEDs.

But I do like to think about, uh, what
we call room temperature to, um, ratio.

So it's room temperature to
radiation ratio, excuse me.

And so when we're looking at that,
we're thinking about how much heat

is produced on the leaves when the
specific light spectrum hits that leaf.

Right?

And so with HPSS, we have quite a
bit of red spectrum light, um, We've

got quite a bit of infrared light
and those waves are gonna create a

little bit more heat on the leaves.

So when we think about changing from
LEDs to, uh, or excuse me from HBS to

LEDs, a lot of times we're gonna have
to up that room temperature because

the leave temperature is actually gonna
be decreased due to less radiation

hitting the surface of those leaves.

And so in order for us to, you know,
achieve the same leaf P D um, and we

we've talked about, uh, leaf VPD versus
room VPD, uh, in this case, making a

modification from HPS to LEDs, you need
to readjust your, your known offset

between the leaf VPD and the room P D.

So when, uh, when we increase that.

Room temperature.

We can help the plant keep up with
an actually a higher metabolic rate

versus an HPS simply because we've
got a higher temperature in the room.

Um, and the leaves aren't working
as hard to reduce their surface

temperature just with transpiration.

So, uh, in C3 plants like cannabis,
97% of the water uptake in the plant

is, uh, expired through transpiration.

And, uh, sometimes that
transpiration is what is.

Just keeping the leads.

Cool.

And so when, uh, when we're changing
from HPS to L E D, obviously we can

get a little bit more efficiency.

Typically, if we do make the
appropriate adjustments, sometimes

we can actually grow a plant faster.

Um, the irony there is that we are
hitting the plant with a different

spectrum, and sometimes that actually
completely modifies how long it

takes the plant to ripen as well.

Um, and a lot of times we can get
a bigger plant simply by making

those changes, increasing our,
uh, metabolic rate in the plant.

So basically more
photosynthesis can happen.

Maybe it takes a little bit
longer for that plant to ripen

throughout the entire cycle.

But usually if the appropriate
modifications are made, we can end

up with a little heavier panel.

Kaisha: Yeah.

I mean, What it all boils down to
for growers is we want RuBisCOCO.

Well it's action inside the
plant, inside the cell to be

operating at an optimal rate.

If we want the most plant growth, that's
why we're targeting that leaf surface

temperature, you know, the 80 to 82,
usually that's not just because we, you

know, we've looked at it and seen, oh,
Hey, plants are happiest at that rate.

Or they grow the fastest.

When we start to look back into
the biochemistry behind it, that's

the temperature that we have the
most optimum interaction and best

efficiency for these enzymes to start
assembling carbon and making sugars.

If we slow down the temperature, less
sugar production, let's plant growth.

Like Jason said, you know, RuBisCO,
go's building these sugars that

eventually power the cells.

It ends up as ATP.

Um, if we don't have the temperature
to actually reinforce that production,

we don't get as big of a plant.

So when we're talking about,
you know, running lower temps,

uh, let's say during generative.

During stretch.

That's been, you know, over the
years of strategy, some people have

employed, especially, let's say in
like a, you know, double tier system

to keep plant height down because we
know that it's say 78 degrees versus

82, we have a lower rate of plant
metabolism and a lower rate of stretch.

Um, as far as RBIS goes, is concerned,
uh, role in how we make our decisions goes

as though I'm glad someone brought it up.

That's really cool.

Backend biochemistry.

Um, it's not something
we think about directly.

Typically when we're manipulating
choices, we're manipulating the

environment in the garden, but
again, that's something everyone

should be looking into understanding.

Some of these processes is really cool
because you can kind of get an insight on

why, you know, why we're looking at that
and then kind of extrapolate, okay, now

that we look back, if I understand why
we're making these choices, I can really

identify some of the stuff out there.

That's bad information.

You can go, Hey, that, that growth
strategy you have, doesn't really jive

with how I, I understand plants work,
therefore, uh, you know, maybe I'm

gonna modify those strategies or decide,
Hey, I'm not gonna risk my crop on, uh,

running 90 degrees and 80% humidity.

Let's say you go, okay.

Maybe it works.

But from a scientific
perspective, I don't get it.

Not taking the risk.

Jason: Yeah.

And I think last week we mentioned,
uh, the balance as far as, you

know, crop steering strategies go.

And, you know, Seth talked about,
you know, lowering temperatures

for a, a generative signal.

Well, sometimes if we're pushing
really hard, maybe our irrigation

schedule is extremely generative and
we have a perfectly sized substrate.

Sometimes we can keep that temperature
up and mm-hmm, increase, you know,

keep that metabolic rate very quickly.

So we're basically just
tricking the plant physiology.

So we're using maybe a really, really
hard generative irrigation schedule

to get that reduced node space, keep
that plant from stretching, um, and,

and keep those temperatures up and,
and get it growing as fast as possible.

So I just wanted to mention, you know, it
is that balance that we're talking about.

And every once in a while, uh, and
specifically we're certain strange,

you can get away with some, some
cool tricks that end end up, uh,

giving you a major advantage.

Kaisha: Yeah.

And I, and I think an important thing
to remember when you start looking at

biochemical pathways and stuff is, uh,
you know, if we're looking at just sugar

production, respiration, those are things
that are happening inside the plant.

A lot of what we do with plant
morphology control is a lot more, uh,

dependent on plant growth regulators
in their balance inside plant tissue.

So although we're, you know, speeding
up and slowing down growth, we're

also, you know, manipulating different
morphological traits through,

uh, just plant growth regulators.

A certain balance will tell
that plant to stretch longer.

Literally it cells are gonna stretch
more versus divide for the plant to grow.

So when we're looking at that,
um, don't go too deep and make

really big decisions based on that.

Look at, you know, there's a lot of
good standard information out there

and just understanding the relationship
between some of these backend concepts

and how we apply them is really
important before you go forward with

doing some more, uh, I guess radical
strategies that are out there.

And that's not to say that
some of the stuff we do, wasn't

considered radical a few years ago.

Yeah.

Jason: And you know, when, when we're
analyzing something like RuBisCO

code, it's probably at the scientific
level versus an application level

in some of these operational, um,
implementations that we recommend

and obviously very, very cool stuff.

Um, how, in the end, you can change
what you're doing in your rooms, uh,

to modify something like that may
not be as important as what, when

we look at what we're doing in these
rooms to modify the end output of

a plant, say that, that morphology.

So by tricking the, um, physiology to
the morphology for, for an increased.

Kaisha: Yeah.

And, uh, you know, heading down that road,
if you're really gonna get that far into

it, you're gonna start wishing there was
like a C4 photos version of cannabis.

Like, you know, you're gonna start
to see some of the other, uh,

other systems that are out there
in different plant species that are

either more efficient, less efficient.

Um, you it's, it's more of a botany
implant, physiology, exercise

and exploration than anything.

I mean,

Jason: we've, we've seen what,
uh, what was done with corn

in the last hundred years.

So who knows what, uh, what
grow in like a century from now

Kaisha: true?

Oh, my goodness.

Cannabis is century from now.

Let me, let me focus.

Okay.

uh, we got a question here from our good
friend Billbo who's on with us live.

Billbo you wanna unmute yourself
and ask it or shall I ask for you?

No, I'm here.

Hey, welcome.

Hi.

Is there any evidence to suggest that
environmental settings should be adjusted

during different steering techniques
and to expand on that a little bit?

Well beyond, uh, the, the norms
of what you'd see within, I guess,

the HPS double-ended world and your
L E D world given transpiration

rates and light spectrum.

Jason: Um, you know, that's gonna
kind of come down to genetics.

Uh, you know, there's some genetics that
can take advantage of say five, six degree

increase in room temperature when we
switch from something like HPS to LEDs.

Um, you know, another thing to think
about as well is when we've decreased

the amount of water going through
the plant, just for transpiration.

Now we have more, uh, water in
that plant that's, uh, being used

for, um, for growth processes.

And so we're probably gonna have to up
the EC when we get under LEDs, because

the we're not transpiring quite as much.

Kaisha: Yeah.

I mean, really a lot of what it boils
down to is that leaf surface difference

or leaf surface temp difference, right?

Like with our I lights, we've
got a lot of radiant heat coming

out with the LEDs we don't.

So the difference is usually with, I D
we're seeing two to five degrees above

room temp at the leaf surface led.

We're seeing, you know, one to four
degrees below room temp typically.

So, and especially once you factor
in your ventilation, you've got

fans blowing around in there.

So really it's just accounting
for that difference.

And then understanding that what
we're chasing is that leaf surface

temp, and really trying to dial
that in, you know, we're trying to

keep everything stable in the room
and do what the plant's telling us.

It wants us to do essentially following
its cues rather than, you know, focusing

on, uh, what if, if my leaf surface
temp says 78 and my room's running at

82, um, my room might end up running
at 86 and, you know, normally for me.

I would be like, whoa, what's going on?

I'd do that with customers.

Actually, sometimes I'm like, Hey,
it says your room's pretty hot.

Oh, we have LEDs.

Okay.

Well then we don't have to worry about it.

It's just, it's a, it's a simple math
problem that needs correcting basically.

Jason: Yeah.

And you know, anyone that is
making that transition, I guess the

easiest way to know how much you'd
need to adjust is go in and take

some leaf surface temperatures.

Uh, you know, I recommend taking quite a
few samples, a across the, the Leafs some

up in, in the higher canopies, some up in
the lower canopy and compare that to the

leaf surface temperatures you were seeing
in, in IDs and just up your room, the,

the temperature difference that you see,
um, from the original leaf temp to the,

the leaf temp after you've changed LEDs.

Kaisha: Yeah.

And, uh, also if you are budgeting
for LEDs budget for more deh capacity,

generally, if you can't push higher
than a two with your IDs, uh you're

you're not gonna be able to cut it
with your LEDs, given the same size

room and same Dehut deh equipment.

That's great.

Billbo did you get your
questions answered there?

Yes.

Awesome.

Thank you for submitting.

That's a good one.

All right.

Another one of our attendees
mark is on with us.

Posted a question here, mark.

You wanna ask it?

You're you're he's he's busy.

He's busy back there.

Yeah, I'll ask it.

Okay.

Goi right now, um, the, the EC,
so we use trim master sensors, uh,

right at water content sensors.

The WCS ones were crack.

We got WCS twos.

Now they're a little
better, but they're still.

Far from optimal.

Uh, uh, the, what we're finding is
the EC is affecting the WC, right?

Uh, so we are, uh, at least the
reading that we're getting from

the control master controller.

So, um, when we drop the EC from
like 3.0 to 2.0 week seven, let's

say, uh, it, it takes, uh, the medium
a couple days to balance out what

it's gonna be for the next week.

And we're chasing the water content
because it's dropping too damn

fast and we know it's not accurate.

Um, so, but, but the readings that we're
getting are, are, are, are not reliable.

Um, and, uh, I've, I've got
a, I've got a system, a DIY

system in place that is water.

Based on, uh, water content
readings from those sensors.

So I have to be able to trust them.

And I don't.

Jason: Yeah.

So I, I guess this kind, let's just
talk about the root of this challenge.

And it comes from, uh, most of the sensors
that are in these industries have come

from traditional horticulture practices
and we don't necessarily see the type

of EC levels that we can run in cannabis
for most, uh, most productive growth.

And so, you know, in something like
if we're trying to grow, uh, you know,

lettuce or even tomatoes who are typically
never gonna see something in that say five

to 10 EC range, it's just way, way beyond
what the plants will happily tolerate.

And so, you know, a lot of the sensors
out there ha have not been calibrated

appropriately or simply don't have
the ability to read water content

appropriately at those high ECS.

And we're fortunate enough that you know,
that the terrorist 12 is, uh, A lot of

generations beyond where our first, uh,
EC water content sensor was, uh, you

know, we've been developing these for
about three, three decades at this point.

Um, and so what we've done is
just calibrate those up into say

the 20 to semen range to, to try
and hold accuracy throughout.

Um, you know, fortunately we use a
patented circuitry in there that is

able to support a fairly accurate,
um, calibration across the board.

You know why we do see some amount of
changes, you know, effective of water

content on EC it's very negligible
with the tariffs 12, um, that can't be

said for, uh, some other sensors out
there, maybe the Klima or, or the troll

master, you know, especially some of
the, the more cost cutting, uh, types

of sensors out there, or, or some of the
companies that, that don't quite have the

research history that that meter group
does supporting, uh, aro in this case.

Um, I don't necessarily have a
great recommendation on how you

can get around that other than
maybe trying to, to map exactly how

far off it is with your sensors.

Um, and, or, or try, try to get
into a little better sensor suite.

Yikes.

Kaisha: Uh, yeah, I was just
trying to see if the, if the

platform handles that, uh, better.

Cause I feel like it's just,
it's sort of like a math equation

based on what's being read.

Yeah.

And you know, one thing to remember
too, if you've got a calibrating

sensor, that's gonna be really hard.

The more times you calibrate it to be
accurate because what we use as a solid

state calibration leaving the factory.

So when we're calculating the information
coming in off that sensor, when Roy is

dealing or, uh, processing that we there
there's no changed variable in there.

There's no trusting that, you know, the
cultivator went and set, you know, max

saturation at max saturation with VWC.

It just is what it is.

And there's no cut, you
know, it's cut and dry.

There's no question on it.

Okay.

Um, Thanks my second.

My second question is on the,
the open sprinkler integration.

Um, uh, I I've, uh, like I said, I've
developed my, my system based on the,

the, the readings we get from the,
take it out on and home automation.

Um, but it's, it's got a lot to be
desired as well, but we're making due.

Um, so the, how, how is it handled?

Like if you wanted to feed one strain
differently in, in, in the same room

or maybe there different harvest groups
going on in a room, would you actually

feed those, uh, zones differently based
on your, uh, water content reading and.

Just real quick, mark.

Just wanna let you know, we're gonna
have a whole episode dedicated to,

uh, the open sprinkler integration.

Very, very soon.

We're gonna be making
that announcement soon.

We're working hard at work on it.

So I just wanted to clarify that.

And then Seth and Jason, I don't know
if you wanted to speak to his question

Jason: anyway.

Sure.

Absolutely.

And you know, the answer is yes.

Uh, if you have the energy to be
able to steer crops differently in

a room that is multi cropped, then,
uh, your plants will reward you

with that, that type of dedication.

Um, at some of the larger
facilities, we see that they just

have too much complexity to be
able to manage some of that stuff.

Um, and as far as the, the details
in the open sprinkler itself, yes,

you can run different irrigation
schedules for, uh, different zones.

Uh, the wonderful thing about the
array integration is, you know, we're,

we're mapped our zones directly to
the channels on that open sprinkler.

So, you know, you have a, a mapped visual
of which zones are, are related to which

harvest group you can change the timing
on each of those harvest groups as well.

So maybe we have, uh, one set of
plants in there that prefers a,

a shorter generative, uh, cycle.

And a longer bulking vegetative cycle
then, uh, then you can just map that

out even before you get that, that
plant started and we're gonna up update

the irrigation schedule when each of
those different harvest groups land

at that point in the plant life cycle.

Great.

Well

Kaisha: done.

Awesome.

Thank you, mark, for your question.

Um, yeah, it's popping over on YouTube.

So I'm gonna get to get
some of those questions.

Hoffman's choice from Detroit rode in.

Do you guys have any irrigation guidelines
for freshly transplanted plants in

order to invoke root production?

Currently I water every four hours
until I see some real dry back

and then I change any advice.

Uh, you know, that's, that's not
too bad provided you're putting on

very, very small shots at a time.

You know, typically what we want to
do is after transplant, give that

plant one to two very small shots per
day, as we watch that water con that

volumetric water content line fall.

So basically we don't wanna bring
it back up to field capacity until

we've achieved a pretty decent
drive back typically about what we'd

wanna see in our generative steers.

So that 15 to 20% minimum, but the
key is we're giving it fresh water

every day to keep that root zone
aerobic and not suffer any damping

off or root rod issues that'll happen.

And you know, the other thing you remember
too, especially if you're transplanting,

you know, on top of slabs or unit blocks,
plant roots, don't know what gravity is.

They don't know to grow down.

They follow the path of water and they
follow the path of water by following

the air that the water sucks in behind
it, into the pours in the media.

So we have to give those plants
or those roots, a path to follow.

If we don't.

Typically is not gonna be a very
stimulating growth into your transplant

media, especially if it's on top.

And we, you know, we just wanna make sure
they're healthy and fresh the whole time.

You don't want to just neglect
them for two weeks or a week.

Jason: Yeah.

So I just gonna say the same thing
basically in different words.

And one is, um, those daily irrigations
are encouraging, uh, plant growth.

They are simulating the
growth of the roots.

Uh, when we overwater our plants
are gonna get lazy and they're not

gonna seek out that lower media
and mean Gulf fit as quickly.

Um, and, uh, if we underwater, we're
just gonna stunt the growth of the plant.

So it's the happy medium in between there.

And, uh, you know, and it
sounds like you're on a pretty

good path, uh, to doing that.

So usually we just call it a dry down
segment, uh, while we're rooting in.

And that is, you know, every day
we wanna see the overall water

content decrease after transplant.

We wanna make sure we do get those
irrigations in there on a daily basis.

And once we see that, uh, that water
content hit a say, 15 or 20% decrease

from original transplant, then, then
let's move into some generative steering.

Kaisha: Yeah.

What I can say honestly, is that
was something that was always a

little frustrating without, uh,
without monitoring equipment.

You know, it seemed like some plants
had be nailing it on and then a

quarter the table, like they're way
overwatered, you know, and now I can

actually quantify that and say, all
right, across this veg table, let me

put on this small shot that I know is
not gonna overwater any of these plants.

And I also know that I've got a few days
where I'm still just gonna be putting on

those small shots and chasing it down.

And, you know, without the tools, it's
really, it's a lot harder to have the

confidence that you're doing the right
thing, you know, especially if you can't

look back and say, Hey, that's where
we messed up last time, even though

we're trying to do the same strategy.

It's all about having the tools to
do your job better growers also.

And we had another question
coming over on YouTube.

Lou wants to know can, and should
your sensors be calibrated to a

specific soilless substrate per meter
group's directions in order to achieve

plus or minus, um, accurate one to
2% accuracy, especially in cocoa.

Um, for example, based on its use of
substrates, uh, dye electric properties,

does the sensor account for the difference
between the makeup of a hor grow purchase,

uh, versus Dutch Plantin, cocoa pot,
smaller, uh, larger sizes of cocoa.

Sorry, that's a lot in, uh, one question,
but, uh, I can repeat it if you.

Jason: Um, so from our opinion, it's
not worth doing a specific calibration

between, uh, two different types of,
uh, soilless medias, especially if

you're within cocoa, um, or within
rockwool or within a cocoa Pete per

light makes any of that type of stuff.

Um, and, and the reason is, is
mostly because it's gonna be hard

to see that amount of accuracy,
even between sensor installations

across the facilities, right?

Mm-hmm so that last, you know, one
or 2% that we might gain from being

specifically calibrated, we're not
gonna be able to reach that with the,

with even a great sensor installation.

Um, and the.

I guess stepping back and, and taking
the, the whole value of it is really

looking at the time series data as well.

So we've got a population of plants.

We've got sensors in a sample of that
population, uh, that sample, you know,

even at some of the best growers,
I'll see, you know, 5% variation

from, uh, top water content to bottom
water content in, in those samples.

And so, uh, I guess, uh, from my
standpoint, um, you know, without

trying to, trying to, um, get too
offensive is just that there's

energy spent better elsewhere.

Kaisha: Yeah.

I, I mean, I think you
brought up an important point.

Jason, when we're looking at
this room, it's, it's dynamic.

We don't have a set value
for all the plants in it.

And that's why, you know, whenever
we're talking about like water content

values for crop sharing strategies,
especially in terms of dry back,

we're always patting everything
with about 5%, if not a little more.

And actually it's gonna depend when
we go and look across your room.

If, uh, you've got five sensors in
there and five benches and you run

out and take 25 spot measurements,
and then we discover that, Hey, you

got about 10% variance on each bench.

Those are the parameters
we have to work in.

At that point, we know that based
on our one sensor that might say

50%, we have another plan at 40%.

So we've got a plan for
the best worlds for both.

We're playing a game of
averages at the end of the day.

So, you know, just like in
statistics, when we see one outlier,

sometimes it's initially concern.

But if we look at the whole and
what we're actually able to treat

practically, then we can kind of dial
it back and say, okay, that one to 2%

may not be the most important thing.

And one thing to remember too, um,
you know, there, there is a certain

amount of, uh, user skill involved
in using some of these like highly

precise, scientific instruments.

And I say precise and not accurate because
accuracy can come down to that user skill.

If we want to go back.

2030 years, we could be using only soil
moisture potentiometers and I can give

you a pot that I know because I weigh it
dry and I put X amount of water in it,

and I know how much water's in there.

I can give it to you.

And I guarantee the first 10 or
20 times, you're not gonna get

the right value because that
instrument's difficult to use.

There is a large amount of user skill
involved in attaining that and what

we've got here at Aurea, you know, at the
tariffs, 12 is much easier to use than

anything that's existed historically.

However, um, that doesn't
mean that it's super easy.

That doesn't mean it absolutely works.

If you just jam it in, you know, these
probes are designed to be in constant

contact with both media and water.

Well, if you don't put it in far
enough, or if it scoots out a little

bit, or if we happen to have some
inconsistent media with a big hollow

spot, um, if you're still using perlite
as a big crutch, there's a lot of

things that can really make it, um,
difficult to get an accurate reading.

And it's important to structure
your processes around that.

You know, just little things like if
you've got the terrace 12 and the sous,

you know, for a second, if you're running
around and worried that, Hey, my sous

readings are always a few percent off.

What my TAs reading is in you.

Okay.

Well that terrace reading's been in
there for a few months with roots growing

around it, your sous you're jamming it
in every time you're each installation is

opening up a possibility for a variable
in your own processes and inaccuracy.

So you've always gotta look at like, yes,
we've got accuracy and precision and data.

How precise are.

The things we're measuring, because if
we looked at that table, you know, we're

looking at precision it's how close
are your measurements to each other?

Well, if your table itself, isn't
very precise, you can't expect to get

very precise even with the best tools.

Jason: Yeah.

And, uh, absolutely.

You know, if you've got your drippers,
uh, within 1% of each other, if you've

got your clone and plant growth rates,
as consistent as 1% within each other,

then, uh, then you're on top of the game.

Um, you're, you're the
absolute best in the industry.

If, if that's that's the level that
you're at and we're always working to,

to make our stuff better calibrated
in different dialectic medias.

Kaisha: Yeah.

I'll be perfectly honest.

If, if you're down to the point where
1% matters to you for volumetric water

content, or you feel that it does
in your performance, you wouldn't

be here listening to what Jason and
I have to say, you'd be rolling in

your money and on vacation probably.

Maybe, I don't know,
that's the dream, right?

If you're successful.

awesome.

Thanks for that.

Um, Lu said thank you very much.

Makes a lot of sense.

Um, that's the last question over on
YouTube for now, but uh, you guys keep

sending those in back over to you, Kaisha.

Thank you, Mandy.

Yeah.

Thanks.

YouTube said drop those questions
to over to us so we can get 'em

answered, but we do have a couple
of our attendees here with us.

Dropped a couple questions in the chat.

Billbo you wanna go ahead
and unmute, unmute yourself

and ask your next question.

Okay.

It's probably a repeat.

Are you going to add leaf surface
temperature readings to your platform?

Jason: Um, you know, over the years
we've had a ton of requests for it.

Uh, since leave surface temperature is
usually fairly constant in reference

to room temperature, as long as other
variables, aren't changed such as

light type as we discussed earlier, uh,
typically you can infer and, or make the

same decisions with a room temperature.

Um, so we don't currently have any plans
to release a leaf surface temperature

in our, in our interface right now
that doesn't mean that we won't at

some point in the future, we've just,
uh, we've got some, some other goals

that we're, we're staying focused on.

Kaisha: Yeah.

And part of that, can I add to that?

Um, why Jason brings that up is if
I was out there taking temperature,

leaf leaf temperature samples all
day, am I getting a more accurate VP

D at, you know, right around the leaf?

Sure.

But if I go do that 20 times and I
watch my VPD on the meter, I know

that under my conditions in this
amount of light, this VPD number

means this leaf surface temperature.

And that, you know, as far as
Jason talking about being steady

state, that's kind of reflected
when we look at VPD charts, we're

always correcting for leaf surface
temperature and we're doing air VPD.

So almost any quick chart you look
up, you're gonna be able to reference

like, okay, are we plus 1, 2, 3,
4, or minus 1, 2, 3, 4 on leaf 10.

So it is important, but the actual
number that you're adjusting your system.

The things that let's say your HVAC
system can sense is not leaf surface VPD.

So we've gotta take that and
transfer it into a number that

we can actually work with.

Jason: Yeah.

And, and kind of just thinking
about how, um, leaf surface

samples are taken right now.

Um, Most commonly is done
with the infrared thermometer.

Uh, one of the things that I loved doing
as a cultivator was actually taking a

thermal camera in there, a and checking
out the dynamics across the plant, as

far as leaf surface temperature went.

So instead of having very small point
measurement, I could capture a whole plant

or a whole canopy and, and check out all
right, here's the temperature of my buds,

where I'm not getting transpiration.

Here's the, the top level temperature
of, of my plants, which one, which

are the ones that are getting the
most radiation from the lights.

And, and here's the
temperature down lower.

Um, also fun to check out, uh, check out
your planters with that thermal camera.

You some sometimes see that
the water flow, just because of

the changes and temperatures of
irrigation from the drippers.

Uh, I was able to catch a lot
of clog drippers and emitters

because of the thermal camera.

I could see that, Hey, the left side
of my planter is not getting cooled

off for my, from my irrigation systems.

Um, so if you know, you have the,
the resources to do so in the time

and interest, uh, go check it out.

You can definitely learn a lot about,
uh, your plants from, from doing that.

Kaisha: Yeah.

And that's a good point too.

And we're trying to dial
leaf surface temperature.

We wanna look at, you know,
the leaf surface temperature

across the plant as well.

If we just dial into those top
nugs, then our bottom Lu nugs,

probably aren't gonna look too great.

So we really wanna look at
that whole plant and say,

okay, what are we equating to?

You know, at this level of light
exposure and least surface temperature.

Do we have a less mature
bud, farther down?

You know, that's something
I've noticed over the years.

If you've got a nice purple up
top and then pretty deep, pretty

quickly you get into the green.

Well, that might influence some decisions
down the line where you can go back and

say, Hey, with the thermal camera, I can
tell when I've got too thick of a canopy

too thin, too deep, you know, and really
just, that's taking it from a single

point measurement and making it way easier
to get in all that information at once.

Awesome.

Thank you for that question,
bill Bo, if you have a follow up,

please, you posted in the chat.

Uh, we're gonna move on
to Nathaniel's question.

Nathaniel, you wanna
unmute yourself and ask it?

Or would you like me to ask for you?

No, I'll go ahead and click this one.

Excellent.

Um, so just to bring it back to some,
uh, the crop steering topic, um, for

basically for every, uh, automated
control system manufacturer out there,

there's a different crop steering,
um, technique, uh, that's published.

Um, and so my question is what, uh, if
you guys could, you know, um, discuss a

little bit about the different theories
on crop steering techniques, uh, the

two examples that came to my mind, um,
were the two opposite extremes of, you

know, one suggestion is at different
phases of the plant's life cycle.

You may want to have a dry back down to
20% of BWC, uh, and then all the way up

to, uh, um, saturating the field capacity.

Um, whereas the, you know,
opposite side of that spectrum.

Is to maintain just static water matrix,
tension of a consistent 40 to 50%

VWC throughout the life of the plant.

Um, can you guys speak
a little bit to that?

Jason: Yeah.

Um, and I, you know, I think probably
the biggest differences that's

coming from these manufacturers
is just the, the details of it.

Uh, I'm hoping that everyone else
is pretty close to where we're at

as far as how the science actually,
uh, affects plant physiology.

Uh, I know that, uh, some of the, the
largest rockwool manufacturers, um, I'm

not gonna name in specific, but the.

Probably the ones that are original,
you guys are most familiar with.

Uh, you know, they've been used in peppers
and tomatoes for, for decades and decades.

And, uh, uh, you know, what
we recommend is exactly in

line with what they recommend.

Uh, they've done tons of research
as far as massive production, um, in

those greenhouses, in the Netherlands.

And, uh, and so I, I think the best
idea is to, you know, take the science

behind it and learn the science.

And as you know, we mentioned
all the time, it, when we say

it's strain dependent, um, there
is gonna be different techniques

for the different plant genetics.

And, uh, and so the best way to do
it is learn on how those controls

affect the plant, uh, rather than
just going by a template recommended

from, uh, some company or supplier.

Kaisha: Yeah.

I, I think it's important to remember
that these techniques really are a

set of tools to go in your toolbox,
to apply at times when you need 'em,

you know, you you've gotta learn
when to use what type of screw.

That's something, you know, someone
can give you the toolbox, if you are

not proficient in using those tools,
you're not gonna be able to get it.

And then another thing to really kinda
look at is I'll use liquid versus

salt nutrients as a great example.

You know, if we look at feeding schedules
for the same product, liquid versus salt,

usually the liquid's a little lighter.

Um, it's not quite as aggressive.

Um, basically when you look at those
feeding schedules, we're looking at

what can, we're gonna design a schedule.

That's gonna be reasonable for the person
to accomplish with the tools they have.

So if you don't have high precision
tools, like there's a few crop screen

guides out there that I've seen that
aren't, aren't quite as tight as

some of the parameters we look at.

But if I were to step back and
think, Hey, I'm writing this

guide that hopefully anyone can do
and not fall flat on their face.

I'm gonna be super conservative in that
guide and make sure they don't fail.

You know, I mean, again, like if we go
out to, if we compare to nutrients for

most people at home and in a smaller
facility, Liquids are easier for them

to measure, you know, if I'm only mixing
up two gallons to feed my plant every

day or so, every couple days, my big
plant, uh, maybe I don't want to go

spend money on a scale that would be
appropriate for me to be accurate there.

Well, liquid nutrients
are really easy solution.

I can get my little shot glass.

That's got my graduated milliliters on
it, fill it up to where I need to be.

Boom easy.

Whereas yeah, maybe I don't want to
go spend a hundred, $200 on a scale.

So I think that's really important
to remember when you're looking at

some of this information coming out
of different manufacturers, you know,

uh, one, one name names, but I've seen
one great crop steering guy from a

company that doesn't sell any sensors
and, uh, you know what, they have a

lot of the same science behind it.

But if you look at that, it's got a
lot of padding in it to make sure that,

Hey, you might not get as aggressive
of results as you would as aggressive,

aggressive as results as you get with,
uh, high density sensor population,

but you're getting an improvement.

Just only watering whenever you
feel like it or not having any,

you know, rigid schedule at all.

Jason: It's it's why you'll see us, uh,
us on here kind of scream get a little

squirmish when people ask for exact
DC numbers or exact room temperature

numbers, there's just so many other
variables in play that, uh, that sure.

We can give you a reasonable
range to start with.

Start within that range,
makes modifications, document

those modifications and, and
then make a AB comparison.

Um, obviously the, the key there as well
is don't change more than one variable

if you have any opportunity to do so.

And you want to make an
improvement on there.

Um, the challenge of that in
reality is a lot of times we

don't mean to change a variable.

It's just hard to operate a room
exactly the same for 60 days.

Uh, and this is especially
true in greenhouses it's,

uh, It's very challenging.

Especially somewhere we have four seasons,
like up here in, in the Northwest.

If we wanna do AB testing, we can
try as hard as we want not to make

a change to, to a certain variable.

Um, maybe we're analyzing a
nutrient, well, this month, that

average temperature was 60 degrees.

And last month it was 70 degrees and
nighttime differentials were, uh,

you know, they're 10 degrees higher
right now than they were a month ago.

Um, and obviously we're doing
everything we can to combat that

with, uh, greenhouse controls.

But, uh, it, it, it's not
at the scientific level,

it's at a, at a production

Kaisha: level.

Oh, absolutely.

And I think, you know, one thing
that I, I see a lot in the industry

right now is, um, we're all,
we're all going so fast paced.

Everyone's trying to make it, we're trying
to survive, trying to grow business.

Uh, so it's very tempting
to try to deal with.

Tomorrow's problems, today's
problems in yesterday's problems.

But what we really need to do is
look back and deal with the problems

that happened two months ago, when
we're about to repeat that cycle.

So if we're talking about like,
like say EC coming into ripening,

I can take the same strain and show
you it at two different ECS and

then show you in the jar, smoke it.

You couldn't tell me the difference.

Now there's a lot of factors leading
up to where we're gonna be with that

EC and ripening that contribute to it.

And if we didn't look back at
anything before ripening and say,

okay, where was our EC at what time?

What kind of ranges were we seeing?

How slow did we stack up?

How slow are we tapering?

If can't look at all that, then
we really can't extrapolate much.

Like if you've got Herms in week seven,
you're just throwing bananas, like crazy.

And, uh, you know, you don't, you
can't figure out what changed.

, but you're only looking at that week's
worth of data compared to the last time.

And you're not looking
at everything leading up.

You just, you don't have
the complete picture.

Jason: This is, this is the, the basis
of why we created harvest group recipes.

Uh, take, take a data set.

Here's what we plan to do.

Here's what we're trying to do.

And, uh, then we run a harvest group
analysis, jump into our production page

and check out the harvest group analysis.

Here's how many days that you are outside
of your intended parameters for easy

or relative humidity or any of that?

Obviously, if you you've
nailed it perfect.

Now you can maybe dial in those target
parameters even just slightly more.

Um, and then that's where continuous
improvement comes from is how tightly

can we operate within our plan.

And do we need to adjust the plan if
we are operating tightly to that plan?

Uh, obviously if we're doing
everything we can just to.

Be close to what we intend to do is
it's gonna be really hard to make

improvements on what we intend to do.

Kaisha: Nathaniel, did we
address everything in your

question, in a shout out to you?

Thank you for dropping.

You dropped some, uh, an article
here and a chat, um, love the

resource sharing, but yeah.

Did we cover everything
that you wanted to know?

I, yeah, that, that totally makes sense.

I mean, I, it, it absolutely is.

Um, uh, you know, pretty clear that,
uh, manufacturers are gonna make the

most generalized wide applying, um, uh,
advice that they can give with the least

amount of failure and the largest group
of people, which is their customer base.

Um, and every iterative aspect after
that is going to be, um, based upon

your, your own personal experience.

I was looking for, um,
uh, I suppose a bit more.

Uh, introspection into your
experience in your own R and D.

I know me group has, uh, OROYA has
their own crop steering, uh, program

as well for that same purpose.

Um, uh, but I was looking for, uh, a bit
more insight into, um, the, the effect

of dry back levels are different stages.

What you guys see
personally in your own work.

Um, I is effective.

For example, I, I find that a static, um,
uh, water matrix tension within the 40 to

50% consistently without hitting 60, 70,
80% video VWC, without going down to 10,

20% VWC, keeping that static with just
a couple points, um, of fluctuation for,

uh, for crop doing at different phases.

But the vast majority being that static,
uh, level is the most effective across

the largest, uh, group of strains.

But I was hoping to hear what you're.

Personal experiences were within that as
well, rather than the explanation of, um,

this is why manufacturers do it this way.

Gotcha.

And yet real quick to the point of
the, uh, uh, uh, flowering plants

are GRA Tropic, um, the, uh, the
AMPL organelles inside the, uh, Mari

thematic root cap, um, it's filled
with starch and heavier than the

surrounding cytoplasm causing it to sink
inside the cell, which is what signals

gravity for the root grow downwards.

So, yeah, roots, roots, and
flowering plants are gravity trophic.

They do know what gravity is they do, but
they don't have to choose to grow down.

If I put a plant in a tube and I give
it mesh on the outside of that tube,

I can get air pruning, cuz those
roots are gonna seek out the path of

water and where it's at in the media.

So you're, you're totally correct.

But in application, that's why we're
seeing like, you know, that's why

your roots grow sideways in the slab.

Water's wicking that way.

That that's very, yeah.

It's not a hard, fast rule.

Yeah.

Well, and it, what you're
saying is totally correct.

What we're talking about here is
using that water flow and introduction

of grab or oxygen into that poor
space to stimulate Ruth root growth.

Um, as far as, uh, keeping it static like
that, I, I get where you're coming from.

Um, that's almost going back to
like deep water culture where we're

keeping a static saturation point.

We're keeping a pretty static sea
point and we're just introducing

oxygen all day by keeping it into that.

What we're not doing though, is
putting any kind of, uh, generative

or respiration stress on the plant.

So like if we're watering just in the
morning, we're depriving that plant

of fresher oxygen the rest of the day.

And when we're talking about dry
back, That dry back percentage is a

reflection of, you know, your heat
and humidity in the environment

that VPD and how much transpiration
we're getting from the plant.

So there is no hard, fast rule on how
much dry back comes in that really has

to do with, uh, what kind of media you're
running, you know, with rockwool point,

I, I did really appreciate your, your
acknowledgement of preventing anaerobic,

uh, uh, bacterial development in the
substrate as well through this method.

So that, that was really good insight.

And that's, that's something too.

I have to stop myself.

Sometimes I'll get hung up on, you know, a
little, a little detail, but then when you

break it out to production, um, it's, it's
kind like, you know, when our transplant

dry back, like, yeah, I wanna see that 15
to 20% dry back before we hit it with a

P one, cuz I need to know we're clearing
that, that poor space and giving those

roots oxygen enough that they can grow.

However, I know that I can't just let
those go anaerobic over seven days, right?

We've always gotta find that, that medium
between, uh, the cool stuff and science,

and then actual on the ground application.

You know, like if we were talking
about, uh, oxygenating your water

to feed your plants, that's great.

You know, if I follow down that road too
quickly, suddenly I'm at 70% per light mix

and, uh, really wasting a lot of water.

So, you know, we we've
gotta find that medium.

And as far as, like I said, those dry
back percentages go, as long as we're

seeing that 10 to 15%, that means we've
got a healthy amount of VPD to promote

good transpiration and good plant growth.

Um, keeping it in, especially if
you're in a soilless medium, you know,

our matrix potential is very low.

The plant doesn't, it can't really sense
a difference between 50 or 40, right.

It's very available there.

It can't sense down to 30, when we're
talking about cocoa and rockwool,

it doesn't get difficult for the
plant to start pulling out water

from the media till we start to
approach that wilting point, even

if it's temporary wilting point.

So as far as keeping it static, I think
that the biggest difference would be

looking at like, in that static 40 50,
like I said, that's close as close as

you're gonna get to deep water culture
with some particles around the roots.

And then what we're talking about is
really being able to in, uh, increase that

amount of time that you're depriving the
root zone of oxygen and not depriving,

but you're not introducing anymore.

You're not giving it that
little stimulation to grow.

Yeah, thank you so much, man.

I really

Jason: appreciate that perspective.

Yeah.

And just to kind of go back to that,
you know, the low end of those water

contents, um, when we talk about the major
potential in something like rockwool, uh,

it's very linear, uh, down to about zero.

Uh, one of the very first sensor
installations that I did after joining

on with meter group, I, we did back
east and, um, that next day we had flown

back and I was checking their graphs.

And here, here we were at like two to 5%
and most of these plants and I, I called

'em up and I says, what's what's going on?

And these things all dead.

And they, they took a picture
and sent it over to me.

And I couldn't, I couldn't believe
my eyes, the, the plants had

available water until that substrate
was completely dry, obviously.

That strategy is not realistic in order
to run an entire cycle, because we are

gonna see the degradation of the rock wall
through doing that, to, to that substrate.

And obviously it's gonna be much
more challenging to manage our ECS.

Um, and we would need a much, much
larger substrate once our, our water

holding capacity has, has dropped
that much due to low water contents.

Kaisha: Yeah.

And, you know, honestly, to build on
that a little bit, one important thing

to remember is in, you know, plant tissue
production, we've got water light and CO2,

you know, EC nutrients do play a role in
that, but those are three main inputs.

So if you know, we're driving,
let's say incredibly hard drive

backs to the point where we're
really stressing out those plants.

If I look at that over the
whole cycle, and I say, look,

I needed X amount of light.

I needed X amount of water and I needed
X amount of CO2 to produce this plant.

And that's, that's throwing out
heat, nutrients and everything else.

I can start to quantify that and say,
Hey, look, I actually, by pushing these

huge drive backs ended up giving that
plant a lot less water in a time period

where it actually needed it to develop the
structure it wanted, or it needed to grow.

Cuz when we, when we're steering
these plants, we don't wanna stress.

'em so hard that we're like, uh,
you know, reducing production.

We're just trying to steer
it through hormonal changes.

So like during stretch, we don't,
we're not trying to torture those

plants and make 'em grow less.

We're trying to focus that growth on
increased bud sites, increased stem

diameter, and we're really promoting a
better, uh, PGR balance in there so that,

you know, we don't have, like, let's say
this high oxen production state, which

is normally what we see in stretch.

That's causing the plant to stretch.

We, we want functional
structure, not just.

Lumber

.
Jason: Yeah.

I, I know historically that, uh, a lot
of people talk about stressing their

plants for that, uh, that hormonal purpose
for the, the indication to modify the

plant morphology via physiological cues.

Um, and I like to think about
it a little bit differently.

Not necessarily stressing
it, but, but guiding it.

Um, and it, I, I, we always
talk about a little bit about

the weight lifting comparison.

Right.

You know, if, if, if I am, uh, if I'm
doing some, some heavy, low rep lifting,

then, uh, that's gonna be like generative.

If I'm doing lots of lower
weight reps, that's gonna be a

little bit more like vegetative.

Um, if I go so heavy that I
hurt myself, I'm not gonna

be lifting much at all for a.

Kaisha: Yeah.

And I think, you know, one thing that
honestly, some of the terminology in

this industry has gotten a little or
pushed a little far, like when we're

talking about plant stress, we're just
actually talking about plant responses

and the easiest way, I think where
that term came up is to say, Hey, if

we're depriving something or we're, you
know, doing something that's, doesn't

seem normal, it's gotta be stressful.

Right?

Well, yeah, it, it might not quite be
stressful in the way that you're thinking,

you know, much, much of the way that I
always, uh, kind of bash flushing here.

And that's mostly because of the term
around it, you know, that really in the

industry has come to me like, Hey, we
are watering this until we literally

mechanically flush all the salt out
now, you know, in application, not

everyone is talking about doing that.

some people are just talking
about reducing their nutrient

input and slowly bringing that
EC down, which is what we want.

But you know, you want
to avoid that confusion.

Wow, what a great conversation, Nathaniel,
thank you so much for your question.

Um, Mandy, I'm gonna send it
over to you because I think we've

gotten some YouTube questions in.

Yeah.

Yeah.

We have.

Thank you for that discussion guys.

Um, Diane's hanging out
with us over on YouTube.

He wants to know, um, straight cocoa or
cocoa and Pearlite in your experience.

What's the better medium.

Jason: I, I mean it, I say this
quite a bit and I, I like cocoa

a lot straight cocoa for me
has been consistent forgiving.

Um,

Kaisha: yeah, if you have, I mean,
honestly, really where per light

comes in for me is, uh, you know,
it's something I used early on, not

just my canvas cultivation career,
but gardening in general, uh, before

I knew how not to overwater my plants.

So if you've got a sensor system, um,
don't, don't waste your money on Perla.

You want that bigger gas tank
that the straight cocoa offers,

you know, with a cocoa Perle mix.

Typically we'll see
like 35 to 45% max VWC.

What that means is I, I can't
run a, a 30% dry back if I only

hit 35% volumetric water content.

So that's kind of where it comes in.

On the other hand, if you've got a big pot
and, uh, you're bringing a small plant in

it that per light's probably gonna help
save you from overwatering by holding

a lot more oxygen in the root zone.

Honestly, the biggest difference that
I've seen is, uh, you're gonna go with

a smaller pot with straight cocoa.

You're gonna have the ability to
anyways, and again, especially if you

have monitoring equipment, if you can
see what's going on inside there, you

can really avoid some of those, you
know, blunders that are easy to make

when you're just staring at of pot.

Wondering how dry it is.

Awesome.

Thank you for that.

And, uh, John wants to know.

So I'm switching to pure
Cana, Coco with no crutches.

This next run I'm running in two
gallon pots, um, is 0.08, four way.

Drip going to be enough.

Yeah.

If you're, well, if you're, if you
have enough pump I built a system

before where it takes me, you know, I
don't actually get point a, it takes

a little longer, so just make sure
your specs are, uh, you've got enough

pressure and flow for what you need.

Awesome.

Thank you guys for that.

Yeah.

Back over to you, Kaisha.

Awesome.

Thank you.

I love when we already know the
answers just yes, that's cool.

All right, Billbo dropped
another question in the chat.

Go for it.

Billbo okay.

Scrolling up has leave service
temperature, been correlated

with the model conductance.

And is that why you are potentially.

Not going for the leaf
surface temperature.

Jason: Um, so I, I would probably prefer
just to talk about the relationship

with VPD, um, simply because leaf temp
on its own, it isn't enough information

to estimate, to model conductance.

Um, and that's why you'll hear
us usually talk about VPD in

relationship to small conductance.

So as an easy measurement, VPD
is the best way to estimate

your store model conductance.

Um, and it's gonna be
kind of some type of.

Curve some type of bell shaped curve
where we see that stem model conductance

is highest typically, um, depending on
the life cycle of the plant, you know,

between say 0.7 and 1.5, uh, BPD, if you
will, uh, when we're lower than that,

there's so much moisture in the air that,
uh, our, our plants aren't necessarily

transpiring as fast as they could.

If we go up above those rates at the high
end, then the plants actually gonna close

its mates a little bit in order to retain
water and not go directly into wilting.

Kaisha: Yeah.

And much like R H and VPD.

It's just important to remember with,
to model conductants and leaf BP that

we're looking at two, two separate ways
of looking at, uh, the same problem.

Right.

So before we have, before we can
measure to model conductance.

The, uh, you know, the easiest
way to do it back then was leaf

surface temperature with air P D.

I can calculate then what my approximate
model conductants can be based on how much

pull, how much vapor pressure deficit I
have and how much the plant should bring

up through X amount of Leafs leaf area.

Now that I can directly get that in
micromoles of water coming out of the

leaf, like they're just two different
measurements for a similar thing.

So I would say a good way to equate
those two would be, you know, if

you used to use soil moisture,
potentiometers in the, in ground to

measure, you know, how much moisture
you have in the soil, is that accurate?

Yes.

Does it give you a percentage?

You're inferring something from another
set of numbers in another set of units.

That's the big difference there.

Otherwise we're, we're really
talking about something that's

approaching the same goal.

We're looking at leaf surface
temp or to model conductance.

Jason: Yeah.

And obviously, you know, when we
say VPD related to system model

conductance, that is with all
other variables consistent, right.

That's at the same point in time, uh,
same plant type, uh, same nutrients, uh,

same light quantity, same CO2 levels.

Uh, obviously if we make adjustments
to any of those, it'll change the

relationship that we see between,
uh, the surface temp and, um, or

stone model production, excuse me.

And

Kaisha: BPD.

Yeah.

And that's where, you know, if you're
dealing with, uh, any kind of variation

there, like, let's talk about the
greenhouse where we've got varying

amounts of light and thus our leaf surface
temperatures varying throughout the day.

You know, if I'm trying to just
use that leaf surface, temp and

BPD to calculate my watering needs.

Yeah, I'm not really gonna get
very close in a greenhouse setting.

I might have a very wide estimation, but
pretty much every day I'm gonna go back

and be like, wow, there's a little extra
in the tank than I expected after today.

Or, yeah, it went dry.

We missed the last water.

you know, just trying to keep up on
this, if I'm following the graphs with

my irrigation needs throughout the day.

Awesome.

Thank you so much.

All right, we got one more
question from Laura, Laura.

I don't know if you wanna unmute
yourself, but I feel like this

is a good one to take us home.

Hey, just wondering if there's a
scientific definition for crops

Jason: during, um, phasic parameter

Kaisha: modulation.

Yeah.

I was gonna say manipulating
your environment to promote

a certain plant morphology.

Um, I, I think, uh, Before it
entered the cannabis space as much.

We just called it, uh, growing
intelligently to get the type

of product that you want.

Like here are the practices
that we have to do.

You know, if we're talking about grapes,
for instance, thousands of years, people

have been going out and pruning flowers
early in the season to promote better

grape production that's crop steering.

You know, people have been manipulating
irrigation for thousands of years.

All of that is crop steering.

But if we wanna talk about it
scientifically yeah, just manipulating

the environment that a plant exists
in in order to produce certain growth

results, desired growth results.

Thanks a lot.

You guys, thank you for
your question, Laura.

All right.

And our final minute, Seth and
Jason, anything else you wanna tell

everybody before we sign off today?

Jason: Thanks everybody for joining.

Uh, and we, we really appreciate
our audience contributing

to the questions in these.

And, um, for us, you know, we're always
trying to learn more about this stuff

when we get harder and harder questions.

Uh, I always enjoy trying to learn up
on as much as I can about them before

an episode and, and, and provide
at least the best interpretation

I can, uh, on the subject.

Kaisha: Yeah, absolutely.

I love, I love being able to
touch some of those things.

Like RuBisCO was fun.

Haven't talked about that in a few years.

. Yeah.

Awesome.

Yeah.

To our community.

I mean, this is for you and we thank
you so much for all your questions.

We got a lot of commission, uh,
questions submitted this week

that we weren't able to get to.

So we're gonna put those
off until next week's show.

Um, but the live questions, that's
the best way to hear from the experts.

So thank you to everybody who
submitted their questions either

here on our Hangouts, around
YouTube and Seth and Jason, thank

you for dropping the knowledge man.

Like, wow.

I learned a lot today.

Um, uh, and Mandy, my partner in
moderating, couldn't do this without you.

Thank you.

Always.

Awesome.

All right, folks.

Well, thank you all for joining
us for aro office hours.

This week, we do this every Thursday.

The best way to get answers, like I said,
from the experts is to join us live.

If you have any questions about
aro, definitely book a demo, and

the experts will tell you about
how it can be used to improve your

cultivation production process.

But as always let us know if there's
a topic you'd like covered in a

future, offers our session posted
in the chat, shoot us an email

at support.aroya@metergroup.com
or send us a DM over Instagram.

We definitely wanna hear from you.

We record every session so we will email
it to everybody in attendance, a link

to the video from today's discussion.

And it'll also be on our Aros
YouTube channel, like subscribe

and share while you're there.

And if these conversations are
helpful, please do spread the word.

Thanks everybody.

We'll see you next time.

Great meeting guys.

Thank you so much.

Thank you, Nathaniel.

Good.