OHL 44 TX Take 2
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[00:00:00] Kaisha: All right, it's Thursday at 4:20 PM Eastern. That means it's time for office hours. AROYA's weekly session for cultivators to hear from the experts and talk to each other about what they're seeing with their grows. My name is Kaisha I'm co moderating today with my good friend. Mandy, how you doing Mandy?

[00:00:17] Mandy: Hey, Kaisha, it's another week in another session. Super psyched to be here for episode 44. Hey, did you guys know we're also live over on YouTube right now. I'll be watching for your questions over there. Be sure you're also following us on Instagram [00:00:30] and TikTok for the latest content to help you cultivate your way to success.

[00:00:33] Mandy: But back to business. We got the questions in on Instagram this week. So I'm gonna pass it back to Kaisha.

[00:00:39] Kaisha: Thank you, Mandy. So if you're live with us here, you have a question. Be sure to type it in the chat at any time. And if your question gets picked, we'll either have you unmute yourself or ask for you.

[00:00:47] Kaisha: Definitely drop your email address in the chat too if you wanna be entered into our swag raffle. Seth, how you doing today? Good Kisha. How about yourself? Good writing solo, huh? Yeah. Yeah. All [00:01:00] right, well we got some questions. Are you ready for the first one? Yeah. Throw 'em at me. Awesome. Okay. This is a really good one.

[00:01:05] Kaisha: This was a write in. We got opportunity for a little overview here. So this person wrote in our water activity and water content always relative to each other. I e. Does W increase decrease and water? WC percent increase, decrease, or can AW increase as WC decreases and vice versa?

[00:01:26] Seth: Yeah, so they pretty much go hand in hand. You know, as water content [00:01:30] increases, so does water activity. So they definitely don't have an inverse relationship. Just roughly parallel, we're just looking at two different ways to measure, you know, the amount of water in there. One, we're looking at, you know, by weight, the amount of water we have. The other, we're looking at the amount of energy required to pull that out.

[00:01:46] Seth: Hold on a second. I think we have some mic issues. Can you guys hear me Just fine. Okay, good. So yeah, I mean, where water activity comes in is, you know, when we've got a variety of different consistencies among our product a bunch of different parameters. We're looking [00:02:00] at that kind of groups all of it into, okay, well can it mold or not?

[00:02:04] Seth: Is it going to spoil? So, and we know that, that, you know, that's something that's been defined experimentally over the years. We know there's a range, so we're establishing a water activity level for obviously different pathogens, different things that grow on our product. And even if we're talking about jerky, the idea is we're looking for that point, you know, where nothing that we don't want can grow on the product.

[00:02:27] Seth: It can't spoil. And [00:02:30] also we're maximizing the amount of water we're leaving in there because it's something we sell by weight. So we don't want to just, you know, give grams up to the air. And then for the customer when it really hits. I mean, part of that too is ensuring that when your product goes in the jar, it's exactly the way you want it to.

[00:02:46] Seth: You know, if you've got a less than optimal packaging area, or let's say you are, you know, wholesaling it off, hopefully whatever processor you're sending it to is taking water activity readings right up to packaging to make sure that they're not, you know, [00:03:00] that company that gets known for selling dry weed or selling it, you know, not fully cured yet, or you know, on and on.

[00:03:07] Seth: And that's another part too. Not just, you know, quantity, but really ensuring quality. We can use water activity at different points in the drying and curing process to make sure that we're in the right water content range for that curing activity to actually happen. You know, and I think for cultivators, it's something in the industry that, depending on how your company's set up sometimes that's right outta your hands.

[00:03:28] Seth: You know, you've got a post [00:03:30] production department that takes care of all that, but it's something we always should care about. You know, if you're a cultivator, you want your product to be represented. A certain way, you don't want it to hit the, hit the shelf and be something that you would consider to be inferior, that you wouldn't smoke.

[00:03:45] Seth: So I think it's really important for user and quality and, you know, even if, let's say cultivation your, your duty ends once it's in the dry room again, you really want that representation because going down the line, I mean, part of your [00:04:00] skill as a cultivator is gonna be able to produce this good product regardless of what facility you're in.

[00:04:04] Seth: Right? So it's not in anyone's interest to put out light over dried, under dried anything but premium product.

[00:04:13] Kaisha: That's right. It's about the longevity of your business. All together. Yeah. Great. Thank you for that overview. Awesome. I'm gonna move on to the next Instagram question. Just a reminder to, to everybody who's on with us live, to have your question in the chat so we can get answers from Seth.

[00:04:27] Kaisha: All right. LA key wrote in a question.[00:04:30] What are your thoughts on dosing a wedding agent into your irrigation system to rehydrate compromised rockwool? Any

[00:04:37] Seth: thoughts on that? You know, I personally haven't tried it, but I do have some concerns about how that wedding agent would be delivered via drippers.

[00:04:45] Seth: I don't know if you would quite get, you know, the even dispersion that you'd want compared to like a dunk soak. And, you know, I think there is possibility you could use that wedding agent to help mitigate some of the dry pockets, but [00:05:00] I can't guarantee as to how that's going to or can't guarantee what that's gonna do in respect for your nutrients.

[00:05:06] Seth: And then also, I can't guarantee that it's gonna work. You know, we're, we're fighting cohesive forces in there, or lack of cohesive forces between the water. A wedding agent, you know, can really help with that. But at the scale we're talking about, which is very, very small, I mean, a, a strand of fiber inside a rock wall is just minuscule.

[00:05:26] Seth: So we're talking about water contact on a basically microscopic level, [00:05:30] and then those little lack of the tiny bits of non-contact on a microscopic level become a macroscopic bubble or dry spot in there. So the wedding agent may help. I wouldn't ever make that a part of my program that I wanna lean on, though.

[00:05:45] Seth: Could be good remediation, but I, like I said, personally, I haven't tried it. I wouldn't guarantee that it's gonna work that well.

[00:05:54] Kaisha: Excellent. Great considerations for lucky to think about. Cool. Thank you for your question, Lockie. Mandy, we got [00:06:00] something in over on YouTube. Oh

[00:06:01] Mandy: yeah. It's popping over there on YouTube.

[00:06:03] Mandy: So Dr. J 3 0 3 wrote in my runoff at pH is coming out at 3.9. I've been hand watering the whole time and not much runoff so far. What should I do and what range should my plants be at? I'm in three gallon pots of coco Per

[00:06:17] Seth: light? Yes. You wanna be feeding between a five, six and a six. Oh. Usually closer to six.

[00:06:22] Seth: Oh. You know, you didn't, didn't really mention what your feed P E C, or pH were, but ideally you'd want your [00:06:30] runoff to come in just a few points below where you watered in, or a point or two above is okay too. But we don't wanna see any massive swings in there. You know, if we're going in a five nine and you come out at a five seven or five eight, perfect.

[00:06:42] Seth: If we're looking at, you know, over a whole point difference, So we go into a five nine and we're coming outta a four nine or a three nine. Well, what we're looking at is a ionic imbalance in the block. So we've got the wrong ratio of nutrients in there, not only for the plant, but that's pulling our pH down, which has the side effect of restricting [00:07:00] nutrient up.

[00:07:01] Seth: So when we have a low pH situation, you might end up chasing your tail and thinking like, I've got a nitrogen deficiency, I've got a magnesium deficiency. When really you just have a bottleneck in the plant's ability to uptake some of those elements. 3.9 is definitely a spot where I would be a little bit worried.

[00:07:18] Seth: It sounds like you're probably potentially not feeding enough and the lack of runoff is not restoring that ionic balance inside the media. So we're looking at a situation where we [00:07:30] probably need to push a little more runoff and then, you know, on your next run, paid more attention to those pH numbers.

[00:07:36] Seth: And especially if you're running, you know, drained to waste and we're looking at it. That's, that's part of why pushing runoff even to check those pH numbers is a good practice. Because as the plan is pulling out, you know, when we're talking about ionic balance in there, we've got cat ions and an ions.

[00:07:51] Seth: Cat S have a negative charge, and s have a positive charge. As the plants pull out most of the an ions, that solution becomes more positively [00:08:00] charged, which is a lower pH. And that's what we wanna avoid. So, you know, kinda short story long there. Probably run a little more runoff. You might need to feed at a higher ec and then really make sure you're paying attention to your input pH depending on your water quality, where you're at and what specific fertilizer you're using.

[00:08:19] Seth: Sometimes it can be tricky to maintain a pH pH in your reservoir too. You know, you might mix it one day and realize, Hey, I need to go check twice a day, at least on my reservoir. Drop a [00:08:30] probe in and see what my pH is. Because a lot of times, you know, as we're sitting there, pH will tend to rise or fall depending on what you've put in the water.

[00:08:38] Seth: We've got an acidic solution. We've got a lot of hydrogen ions in there, for instance, that hydrogen can gas off. So therefore our pH is gonna be, or our solutions gonna become less positive, that pH is gonna slowly creep up throughout the day. So definitely make sure you got a lot of consistency sometimes just cuz you mix a tank.

[00:08:55] Seth: And if you wanted to leave it for a couple days, that probably could be a big source [00:09:00] of that low pH. Not guaranteed, but again, it's a dynamic system and we always wanna check on it, make sure it's doing okay. And also, you know, when we're talking about irrigation as far as that goes, even between your tank and your emitters, you know, something you always want to do when you're out there in the garden is get not only your runoff you see in pH, but also your feed you see in pH at the dripper.

[00:09:21] Seth: If you've got some design problems with your irrigation system or some malfunctioning equipment and you think you're feeding it a 3.0, but you're actually feeding it a [00:09:30] 1.5 or a 1.8 or you know, let's say we've got some digitally controlled injectors that are plugging up and we don't have a redundant notification system, the only way you're gonna know is to go take that sample.

[00:09:41] Seth: And test it. So definitely just keep up on on your SOPs, I guess. Follow the instructions. And , you know, don't, don't let up on it. If you wanna bake a really good cake, you gotta follow every step in between and not take shortcuts.

[00:09:57] Mandy: It's all about consistency, right? Mm-hmm. , Dr. [00:10:00] J, you'll have to let us know if you have any follow-up questions but I believe we have some questions coming in in the chats,

[00:10:04] Kaisha: Kaisha.

[00:10:06] Kaisha: Thank you, Mandy. Awesome. Yes. Michael posted a great question here. I'll go ahead and read it, Michael, and if there's anything you wanna add, feel free to unmute yourself. But Michael wrote in, how do you feel about flood tables for

[00:10:16] Seth: clones? For clones, definitely. Can be a little difficult. I've certainly seen it.

[00:10:20] Seth: If you're using flood tables, you're probably, I mean, you can use domes, I suppose, with those. Overall for cloning, though not typically my favorite. I think they're a great [00:10:30] option. When you get into veg, you've already got rooted clones. Let's say you have your Delta tens that you drop on the slabs, that's a great option.

[00:10:36] Seth: You can put a lot of delta tens on one flood table, have a flood and drain set up, and not mess with all your spaghetti lines. Some would argue that there are some cons to having your, your solution wicked up rather than dripped on from the top. I would agree. That's why generally speaking, I don't really advocate for flood and drain setups on a flowering basis.

[00:10:55] Seth: You know, if we were going in with obviously slabs, that would not be very efficient. [00:11:00] Or the Hugos, the six by six by six, you'd have to have a really deep tray to be able to flood that effectively and we'd be using a lot of water. For clones, I think it's really tough just because when you've got so many different clones in one system, you know, if you've got 2000 clones on the same ebb and flow system, There's a few things you're gonna wanna watch out for.

[00:11:20] Seth: One obviously is overwatering those clones, Some of 'em are gonna be ready to water after just like, you know, four or five days. Some might not need much water at all [00:11:30] going all the way through. So you, you know, that's kind of where that cultivators touch, picking that tray up or like Jason, I always talk about this, get a scale, you know, weigh your whole empty clone, set up, get a weight on approximately what you think those clones weigh, and get a wet weight and figure out, okay, I have X amount of water in my little rockwool slab.

[00:11:52] Seth: The other thing that you might want to, you know, avoid with that is basically the same problem we have with any flood and drain or deep water culture [00:12:00] system. We have a bunch of plants sharing the same media essentially now that we're circulating that nutrient solution around. So that means any kind of infection, bacteria, any kind of pathogen.

[00:12:10] Seth: That gets into that solution can now effectively spread to every other plant in the room. So that's something to be aware of. And then, you know, the other side of it is nutrient management becomes much more of a chore because we're recycling this water. And that means like when we have flood and drain, we're also pulling all of that runoff back into, [00:12:30] So, you know, once depends on what nutrient you're running, how big your plants are, everything else.

[00:12:35] Seth: But typically about once a week you're switching out, you know, all of, or half of your total nutrient solution just to try to restore that cat eye on an in balance because your pH, the pH in that solution, if the plants are feeding, is gonna go down. So we've gotta correct that every day. But I can only put in so much pH up product before I hit a point where you're like, [00:13:00] Yes, I have.

[00:13:01] Seth: My pH correct and I'm putting ppms in, but it's not the fertilizer going in that I need anymore. You know, the, the solution's depleted. So I think it's possible to def to do it, but I don't think I, it definitely leave yourself open to pathogen attack and it's a little bit risky. I would say it's on the surface it seems like it's gonna save you time just cuz you can irrigate all those at once easy.

[00:13:26] Seth: But I think realistically on the back end, [00:13:30] the potential for it to not be precise enough for your different varieties. And then, you know, even when we talk about moms, you've got different levels of mom health. I can have two moms, one's three months old and one's one month old. And if that three month old mom is really root bound, it's been overwatered it's whole life, it's just not in good shape.

[00:13:48] Seth: I can't treat that. Let's say 50 cuts the same as I could off of the other 50 cuts I got off of the other mom. That's much healthier. They're gonna root at different rates. You know, and at that point I should be [00:14:00] able to say, Hey, I'm gonna throw that old one away. But all, all growers live with, you know, space, space limitations.

[00:14:06] Seth: We all have only so many resources to put in any one part of the grow. So that happens sometimes, you know, sometimes we'd have to get those cuts and we don't always have the most optimal mom.

[00:14:20] Kaisha: Amazing. Thank you for that. Seth. We've gotten a couple of comments here on the chat, big scifi. I don't know if you wanna unmute yourself and kind of speak to what you posted here. [00:14:30] Let's see. Definitely wanna share some resources here. So you wrote awesome clarification on the pH question. Yeah. Oh, you're still muted.

[00:14:40] Kaisha: There we

[00:14:41] Seth: go. So, yes, in episode 35, about 35 minutes in, Steph mentioned that as cat irons were being used, as plants were used, the nutrients and s were being left behind, which would then. Raise the pH. Yeah, that's, that's incorrect. Miss you called me. Yeah, no, it's that, [00:15:00] it's that inverse. It's the it's the negative log thing, right?

[00:15:02] Seth: Lower means higher. Yes. I always trip myself up on that. Exactly. Trust your words so much that I, you had me questioning my own knowledge man, so I'm like No, that means you're learning though. When, when you pick that stuff out, you know? I'll do that myself with Vpd and Rhh sometimes too cuz I'm so used to thinking of the cup as a percentage full, not, you know, the opposite.

[00:15:22] Seth: What's the empty part with Vpd? How much suction do we have? ? So. Right. Awesome. So that was all I was asking man. Thanks a bunch. No worries.

[00:15:29] Kaisha: [00:15:30] Yeah. Appreciate your comment. Yeah, love. I love the back and forth. Michael also posted a follow up here Michael, I don't know if you wanna unmute yourself, but I'll read it.

[00:15:36] Kaisha: Domes over the trays on the tables drain to waste feeds hypochlorous acid and the nutrient nicks labor hour limitations. Haha.

[00:15:45] Seth: gotcha. I mean I think that's totally possible then, especially with the drain to waste setup and running hypochlorous. I think unfortunately, you're just never gonna get away from having someone even at that point go in and look at your clones every day [00:16:00] and hit the irrigate button to make sure you're not flooding 'em too much.

[00:16:04] Seth: You know? One other thing, Mikey, that a few people I know are trying out that's interesting, I don't know if you want to do it. They're running arrow CLS to get root initials and then when you've got, you know, almost micro root initials, basically just little bumps of callus on there, that's when you stick them.

[00:16:21] Seth: So food for thought. There's some interesting tech out there that's coming to light, but typically trays, domes, hand watering is like the most [00:16:30] effective.

[00:16:32] Kaisha: There it is. Thank you so much. Yes, Michael, thank you so much for your excellent question. All right. I'm gonna keep it moving on. I got another write in.

[00:16:39] Kaisha: A reminder to everybody who's on with us live post your question in the chat. That is your best chance to get answers from Seth. All right. Michael Rena wrote in and he, he's got some data he's seeing from his soce, so could use some guidance. Cool. I've noticed that when I water three gallon pot with coco, I don't get runoff until the sous [00:17:00] reads 90% water content.

[00:17:02] Kaisha: Should I still treat the dry backs at 20 to 25%, 70, 75% wc or let them dry back to 45 to 50% water content, which would be a 40 to 45% dry back. Thanks.

[00:17:16] Seth: Yeah. Few things to unpack here, I guess. I don't know if you're in a rounder square pot or a bag. All those things have some factors there. The bag's obviously the easiest to get a good reading on when we're talking [00:17:30] about bigger media, typically to get an accurate reading.

[00:17:32] Seth: We're also scooting it up, so if you have like a narrower taller pot, we might be looking at using a different setting than where you'd stick that into a smaller pot, like let's say a two gallon OT bag. So that's definitely something to think about. As far as your dry backs go, though, you know, being that you're in Coco you actually have like quite a bit of freedom.

[00:17:51] Seth: So I would absolutely go for that 45% dry back. You know, you're not going to damage the integrity of that media the same way you would rockwool [00:18:00] pushing those higher dry backs. The biggest thing to watch out for though, and I think something you'll have to just work into your day is, you know, massive ec swings as a result.

[00:18:09] Seth: So using your solace, what we want to do is try to capture, hey, what were we looking at right after our P one s hit? So 15 minutes after P one stops should be done with runoff. Water should have moved around in the media through capillary action to where it's gonna be, let's see what our ECS looking like at that wettest point.

[00:18:27] Seth: There's our lowest point for the day. [00:18:30] Then let's go back and right before P one s start the next day, get that reading and try to make that a habit. Both, you know, it'll be middle of your day when P one s are done and then right before you go home or right when you get there, probably in the morning before they hit.

[00:18:44] Seth: But we can look at that range and it's when that range becomes too large that we start to see, you know, that classic tip burn, lockout symptoms, et cetera. So basically, when you don't have 20, 24, 7 time series [00:19:00] data, we've gotta pick strategic points to measure and find, you know, where we need to be at those points.

[00:19:06] Seth: And then also, you know, if we go, okay we were out of four at our weest and a 20 at our driest. Well, we clearly are over drying that for the amount of salt that we have in there, that's too big of a range for the plant. So we need to either back off on the dry back or push a little more runoff and bring that EC down.

[00:19:24] Seth: Probably a little both.

[00:19:29] Kaisha: [00:19:30] Excellent. Thank you. Michael, thank you so much for submitting your question. If you want some follow-up, send us a DM and we'll we'll cover in another episode. Billbo just posted a question in the chat. Billbo, you wanna unmute yourself and speak to it?

[00:19:41] Seth: Sure. Hey, hey, Billbo. So, hey man, you, you, you brought up

[00:19:48] Guest 1: something that spurred a whole bunch of.

[00:19:52] Guest 1: What I think is correlation.

[00:19:54] Seth: When you started mentioning the Alon, I used to use the [00:20:00] Dewey Mister in Alon,

[00:20:01] Guest 1: and I noticed what you would describe as rapid callousing.

[00:20:05] Seth: Mm-hmm. , I did struggle at that age and stage to about maintain it. I

[00:20:11] Guest 1: think those, you know, best practices weren't necessarily always front and center.

[00:20:14] Seth: Mm-hmm. , but I'm,

[00:20:16] Guest 1: I'm hearing and seeing, and I, I pose another secondary question

[00:20:19] Seth: about, you know, using things like calcium carbonate, maybe some gypsum. And potentially

[00:20:26] Guest 1: adding that into the

[00:20:28] Seth: alon to maybe [00:20:30] induce some very vigorous callouses that would then erupt into a, a

[00:20:35] Guest 1: massive root system and start a plant off.

[00:20:37] Guest 1: Now I don't know if that's just hearsay or I'm piecing together or parles of other conversations, but I, I want

[00:20:44] Seth: see if we can get you to expand

[00:20:46] Guest 1: a little bit more on this AROYA chlo concept of getting

[00:20:50] Seth: our starts started. Gotcha. So, typically like calcium carbonate and gypsum, I probably wouldn't run those through my alon unless I knew I had some kind of massive Mr.

[00:20:59] Seth: Nozzle on [00:21:00] there just because gypsums kind of hard to get to dissolve in water, but there could be something there for sure. As far as the alon or callus tech goes people I work with that are doing it, basically the way it works is you're in there for a few days is all, and once you see those tiny root initials form.

[00:21:15] Seth: And you're using, by the way, you know, a light nutrient solution potentially with some ox in it if you really want to kick it into overdrive. But once those read initials are like one millimeter, two millimeters long, I mean, we're just talking about those bumps on the stem, that's when you're gonna go ahead [00:21:30] and stick it into the rockwool cube and what they're, The reason they're doing that is, and I, I totally understand for them, they're getting easier performance, especially in terms of labor and everything running the alon just because.

[00:21:44] Seth: They have a high success rate with it and it's worked for them for years. So they're sticking with that. But you know, trying to go into rockwool or Coco, I mean, I'm sure if you view sounds like Billbo, UV zero clone a bit. I mean, you end up with these massive root systems that are kind of hard to transplant if you leave 'em [00:22:00] in there too long.

[00:22:00] Seth: Yeah. You know, unruly almost. Yeah. Well, and also the root system, you know, when we grow two and a half, three feet of hydroponic roots, I mean, start looking at 'em, really, those roots actually do tend to grow a little bit differently when they're in, you know, completely water. The arrow roots are a little bit different than the deep water, but I have noticed, you know, if you're pulling apart a coco block or whatever, your roots are a lot more fuzzy when you're in actual.

[00:22:26] Seth: Versus a liquid medium. So I think growing those [00:22:30] big root structures in the aero cl completely unnecessary. We want to take advantage of that quick root initial formation. But I think the plant actually spends a lot of time on further root development redevelopment once you put it back into the soil.

[00:22:43] Seth: Or not soil, but coco, rockwool, some sort of media

[00:22:54] Kaisha: billbo that, Did that answer your question? You have anything else you wanna add? Yeah. Yeah. [00:23:00] Awesome. Thank you so much for submitting it. Yeah. And yeah, keep glad you're good to see you this week. Let us know if you have anything else you wanna ask about. We got in a question over on YouTube, I think, right?

[00:23:10] Kaisha: Mandy? Yeah, we

[00:23:11] Mandy: totally did. Diane rode in. If I drive back Coco too much, did I lose percentage from the full capacity or is that only happening in rockwool

[00:23:19] Seth: cubes? Typically, you're only gonna see that happen in rockwool cubes. It is not impossible to have it happen temporarily in Coco. I've certainly seen it where parts of the pot will dry [00:23:30] out and become hydrophobic, similar to when it's compressed.

[00:23:33] Seth: But that being said, there's, there's a trick. It's just called submerging that pot and some nutrient solutions. So what I like to do is just take a container. You can use a Tupperware tote cl tray, whatever, but when you've got that, basically you just need to go soak that coco pot for not a terribly extended period of time, but you know, 10 plus minutes and basically fill it up and let it stop bubbling.

[00:23:58] Seth: Let the water really penetrate there [00:24:00] rather than dripping it on top. Sometimes if we over dry the coco, let's say we hit like 15% because of the way gravity works now, the top of the pot is the driest spot. Water comes down, the dripper, hits that dry surface, and then just beads off the edge. So sometimes you've gotta do that little bit of a mechanical reset, but no coco doesn't have that same limitation that rockwool does in terms of developing hydrophobic pockets on the inside.

[00:24:25] Seth: Awesome.

[00:24:26] Mandy: Super succinct. Yeah, Diane, I think you're on the call with us. He responded, [00:24:30] but not in easy clean system. I'm in cubes and working fine. I don't know about a missing system

[00:24:35] Seth: if you wanna add anything. I think you're right on there, Diane. Like, the gypsum calcium definitely can't help during cloning.

[00:24:40] Seth: I just would personally, I mean, it's the same reason why I don't play with running a whole lot of different organics at all in my irrigation system. And that's because many of those products are over 99% TAL powder, so similar to gypsum, and those particles are not fine enough to go through U emitters.

[00:24:59] Seth: So [00:25:00] I, and personally I haven't played with, you know, aero ponic systems outside of the Turbo, Cl cl, but I don't like, you know, when I'm talking about Mr. Valves and stuff, I don't like putting anything too chunky through there, you know, or even, you know, even running nutrient solution through there, you do end up having to clean them between runs Soca and vinegar, some other acid to get that salt crust to break up.

[00:25:21] Seth: So it's, it's more of a mechanical limitation.

[00:25:25] Mandy: Awesome. Thanks Diane, for your questions. He said never heard of it. I don't know if you wanna expand upon [00:25:30] that a little bit more. Sorry if I'm never heard. If you wanna add some context, Diane. But yeah, let us know if you have any follow ups.

[00:25:36] Mandy: Billbo did you wanna ask your question or we can ask for you?

[00:25:38] Guest 1: It's okay. Sorry I got cut off earlier there. I understand that to be the challenge. Having had retro, having to have retrofit atypical CLS in the past, and then years ago I came into the knowledge of this product called the Dewey Mister.

[00:25:52] Guest 1: The Dewey mister is just using air through a small device. So there's no moving parts. There is no effective

[00:25:58] Seth: mis

[00:25:59] Guest 1: stand. [00:26:00] It's,

[00:26:00] Seth: it was, I think, initially conceptualized

[00:26:04] Guest 1: around a concept of brewing a brew. In compost ts and whatnot. But I use it successfully in Alon. It definitely, I'm now scrambling to storage to go and find the components to try it out again.

[00:26:18] Seth: I'll have to look into that. That's interesting. Yeah. Less moving parts of, Do we, Mr. Yeah, that sounds pretty Florida. Yeah, that's I'm not to look into that.

[00:26:28] Guest 1: Yeah. Cool. And I, [00:26:30] I'm sorry again, I, I missed what the last part of what you said earlier, but I'll just

[00:26:34] Seth: recap with the recording. Okay, cool.

[00:26:38] Kaisha: All right.

[00:26:39] Kaisha: Keeping it moving here. So many good questions come in. Oh, we got another question from Diane here. Yes. Be happy to ask Seth this question here. Can you ask that if three gallons per hour sprinklers are too much for three gallon pots in.

[00:26:56] Seth: I, I mean, you're definitely pushing the far side of what you need for sure.

[00:26:59] Seth: In [00:27:00] a three and a half gallon pot, typically I would run either a one or two gallon per hour emitter with a splitter on it. Three gallons you can get shots on pretty quickly with a three gallon per hour emitter. And with your three gallon pot, you're probably just fine. Really it's just gonna come down to that, you know, the logistics of how long you want to be able to take for, If you need a 5% shot, is that gonna take you one minutes or five minutes?

[00:27:21] Seth: That's pretty much the biggest difference there. With the three gallon pot, you're pretty well padded. If we're talking about six by six by six rockwool cubes [00:27:30] or a one gallon pot, then you might be blasting it a little hard with the three gallons. It might be really tough to have a seven second irrigation or something like that and have it work nice.

[00:27:43] Kaisha: Great question, Diane. Michael just posted here. I really like the 1 3 1 over three G pH emitters for everything. Three gallon down.

[00:27:53] Seth: I was just gonna say one thing I'll bring up too. Part of why I like running the bigger emitters with the bigger pots is right now if you're [00:28:00] flowering in three gallon pots, my guess is you know, we, we we're pretty far into this crop steering thing now.

[00:28:04] Seth: A lot of, lot of facilities have gone on to the smaller media size trying to get down. I like the orifice size on the one two and three gallon net offi meters. They don't seem to plug up quite as often. And then when I'm running at a bigger commercial scale with a one or a two gallon, or even a three gallon, I got one emitter per plant, not two.

[00:28:23] Seth: So it just simplifies the whole process a little bit. But Mikey, I agree. Generally speaking, I love a third gallon [00:28:30] per hour, a half gallon per hour, two emitters per plant as a baseline set up. Sharing

[00:28:37] Kaisha: the resources. So good. Excellent. All right. I'm gonna move on to a question that was written in on YouTube.

[00:28:43] Kaisha: So this came in actually before the broadcast. Pewter posted this. They wanna know in order to keep room and LS temps up with LEDs, especially in the lower section section under canopy Air intake got switched from floor level to above canopy, hence under [00:29:00] the ceiling. But that interfered with the air outtake.

[00:29:03] Kaisha: I don't want air to move in and immediately get sucked out again. So I was wondering if I can lower outtake ducting, can I just switch in and outtake positions? Would there be something wrong with that configuration if I can achieve the right temps with less cooling and heating? Thanks. Does that make sense to you?

[00:29:22] Kaisha: Yeah,

[00:29:22] Seth: a little bit. I mean, typically with intake and outtake, ducting, we're looking at a few things. You know, we want to have good cross flow across the room, so we don't want the [00:29:30] air to come in and just swirl around one side, come in and right out the ceiling, right? We want to go all the way across the room ideally.

[00:29:36] Seth: So that's something to consider. Usually with our exhaust vents, we're gonna try to pull that out of the upper corner of the room. You want 'em up high that way. We're actually effectively pulling that above lamp heat out of the room. We're getting an actual gradient rather than pulling from just one point in the gradient and leaving dead air and heat up above.

[00:29:58] Seth: So you can certainly switch 'em, you can [00:30:00] play around, but those are a few the main principles you wanna look at. We want total room circulation and you're right, we don't want that air to go in and go out immediately . We wanna take advantage of that. Right. And then beyond that, you know, how does your circulation system in there play into that?

[00:30:16] Seth: Is that helping move the air around positively? Do you just have a bunch of oscillating fans that are kind of all batting at each other and just stirring up the outer few feet of the room? Or do we have like lift fans HVAC socks? How far have you gone with [00:30:30] really getting that fresh air distributed around the room?

[00:30:32] Seth: I think last week, Jason and I brought this up, but the the duct socks are amazing. You know, if you're having air distribution problems in your room and you're worried about where your intake is versus your exhaust with like those duct socks, I mean, you can have your intake and your exhausts on the same wall.

[00:30:49] Seth: You're gonna duct your intake all the way to the back of the room and that air is gonna come back forward. So there's, there's a few options there. The easiest way to figure out is get in your room and start feeling how the [00:31:00] fans blow. And then obviously check and see, you know, are you able to hold those temperatures or not?

[00:31:07] Seth: Great advice.

[00:31:08] Kaisha: Thank you so much. I think we got something over on YouTube, right? Mandy? Copy me over there. Yeah,

[00:31:14] Mandy: we did actually. So Vivid Farms wrote in, do you recommend to continue the same P two schedule as daytime or should I allow more of a dry back between my P twos during the dark period?

[00:31:25] Mandy: Thank you. And is this a follow up? I'm gonna go ahead and ask this too. We're in Hugo [00:31:30] Blocks and we're having to continue CHUs late into the dark period. Day

[00:31:33] Seth: 37. Gotcha. Your plants are way too big for your pots. That's, that's what's going on. Anytime you have a nighttime feeding, that's what we'd call a P three.

[00:31:42] Seth: That's not ideal. That means you've got way too little volume of water for that plant to hold overnight. And, you know, remember when the plant lights off, although we continue getting dry back, that's environmental transpiration and evaporation. That's not transpiration as a result of respiration. So the plant's not actually [00:32:00] using nearly as much water at night.

[00:32:01] Seth: That's why we see that line, that slope taper off a bit. But when you really overgrow it, you're gonna have to have those, those overnight watering. So that my best advice there would be to up your pot size, basically, if you're running transplanting straight into the Hugos, probably switch it up to a four by four by four on top of a slab.

[00:32:22] Seth: Or, you know, some people love running the Hugos on top of the uni slabs or the GR 40 s, but basically, , you need more volume if you want to [00:32:30] be able to run any kind of generative strategy there. For cannabis producers in general, if you're gonna grow a plant over three feet tall, don't buy Hugos. They're just not big enough.

[00:32:41] Seth: And then the same would be true if you're, you know, you're running like, let's say a three liter coco pot. You know, we, we can only get so much water in there. And that's one of the driving factors. We, if we're gonna steer the car or the tractor, in this case, we've gotta have a gas tank. And if you don't have a big enough gas tank, you're just not gonna get very far without [00:33:00] refueling.

[00:33:01] Seth: Wow. Have you

[00:33:02] Mandy: ever thought about your substrate size like that? That's amazing. Yeah. So I think that was it for YouTube for now. Back over to you,

[00:33:08] Kaisha: Kaisha. Thank you, Mandy. Excellent. Yes. Diane posted another question here. He wants to know, did CO2 of 1400 PPM we'll have a negative effects on my plants?

[00:33:21] Kaisha: Did I necessarily have to take it out from the room? Thoughts on that?

[00:33:25] Seth: No actually. I mean, if you were, if you wanted to run 11 or 1200 ppfd of [00:33:30] light, you would in fact need 1400 PPM of co2. We don't typically see CO2 toxicity in plants and pretty much until we're hitting levels that you would be getting a headache.

[00:33:41] Seth: Inside of your, you know, that are dangerous for people. So no, I I'm not necessary to back off. That being said, if we're talking about the last two weeks of flour or so, once we've stopped bulking on size and we're just ripening, theoretically the plants don't need as much co2. However, that doesn't mean to pull it out completely.

[00:33:59] Seth: If you're [00:34:00] gonna go from 1400 PPM down to four, when you cut it, you know, I'd say just pull it back to equal your P P F D during ripening, if anything. So if you're cranking your lights from 1200 down to 800, pull it back to 800. Save a little money. But, you know, there's, there's three big things. Plants really love co2, water, and light.

[00:34:20] Seth: That's their main building blocks. Everything else is to accomplish what those three things are trying to build. And when we limit on any of those, we're possibly leaving something on the table. And [00:34:30] that being said, those are three of the easiest things to provide for the plant. You know, co2, we're opening a valve lights, we're plugging a light into the wall and hitting the switch.

[00:34:40] Seth: And water. Well, the liquid part's just going on. All the nutrients we wanna put in the water. Maybe that's where it gets a little harder, but there's no reason to skimp to your skimp on what you're giving your plants for those three fundamental pillars, I guess

[00:34:57] Kaisha: since Seth and actually Diane just clarified, he's talking [00:35:00] about nighttime.

[00:35:00] Kaisha: So I dunno if you wanna add based

[00:35:04] Seth: honestly unless you're constantly venting out and you need to spend money replenishing that CO2 all night, it should be fine. You shouldn't, your plants shouldn't be using as much of it at night at all. So easy enough to maintain.

[00:35:17] Kaisha: And Mikey, thank you so much for your comment as well.

[00:35:19] Kaisha: Mikey posted As long as you have the PPP to match, no problem at all. My rooms are frequently between 12 to 1500 ppm. Yep.

[00:35:26] Seth: Thanks Mikey. And you gotta clarify, my rule of thumb is always [00:35:30] ppfd plus 200 or two 50, you know, and I know there's probably plenty out there that would say, you know, just equal ppfd.

[00:35:38] Seth: I just like to play it on the safe side cuz CO2 is not pretty expensive currently. That obviously could change someday.

[00:35:47] Kaisha: Awesome. Great question. Diane, thank you so much for submitting it. Great conversation and great answers, Seth. All right, I'm gonna keep it moving through. We have a few more questions from Instagram.

[00:35:57] Kaisha: This was kind of an interesting one. We get [00:36:00] questions like this from time to time, so Seth, I'd love your tick on it. Chris bag Bagian is looking for feeding charts for 10 to 10, over 15% dry back. Any thoughts on that? Cuz I know we, we often get these kinds of questions and it's kind of like strain dependent, right?

[00:36:16] Seth: Yeah. It's a little strain dependent. And then, you know, I have to look at plant size versus pot size. So like, if we're looking at a feeding chart, for instance, and trying to build one, there unfortunately [00:36:30] isn't, there's a, not a uniform temple that's gonna work in every situation, right? So if we're talking about just an average vegetative schedule, or let's start with an average generative, we'll go through the order of flour here.

[00:36:42] Seth: That's characterized by a bigger shot. Now, that shot size, so the number of shots that we're gonna take to reach that 15 to 25% dry back to refi, replenish there, that's gonna change depending what media we're in. And the other side of that too, if we're talking about a 10 or a 15% dry back program, [00:37:00] if we're basing it all on just that dry back number, that's kind of the wrong way to start.

[00:37:06] Seth: In all of this, that 10 to 15% or even up to 25% dry back is indicative that we have proper vpd in the room. Proper light, proper heat, everything environmentally and proper humidity, everything environmentally is looking good. That's reflected in our dry back. Now if I suddenly go say, hey, , everything is within reason.

[00:37:28] Seth: I'm only getting a [00:37:30] 15% dry back. My buddy on Instagram is posting 40% dry backs. I want to get that. Okay, well, I'm in a rockwool slab. He's in one gallon coco pots. That's something you can do in one gallon coco pots. Something you can't do in that rockwool scenario. Now, you're still gonna get great product outta both.

[00:37:50] Seth: We could grow 'em side by side and you probably couldn't tell the difference once it got to the bag. But in with that rockwool, we're going to be irrigating it more. We you're not gonna let it dry [00:38:00] down as far just because we can't, we'll ruin the integrity that media to hold the water, kill our yield. So basically with our generative steer, we're looking at that two hour irrigation window and the biggest shots we can put on, so we minimize that shot frequency.

[00:38:15] Seth: So a lot of times that's characterized by three or four shots, about 30 minutes apart, two hours after lights are on. And then a 22 hour drive back. And then once we hit vegetative steering, we're gonna look at doubling the amount of shots there. [00:38:30] We're gonna go to six to 10, even 12 in the P one, Anywhere from one to 3% of our volumetric water content trying to maximize the number of irrigations we're putting on in P one, Waiting a little bit to get a dry back.

[00:38:42] Seth: And then continuing with some P two s in the afternoon that are also in that one to 3% range. Now if you have low V P D, if you have low P P F D, if you have low temperature, all those things are gonna be affected. We're not gonna see that big dry back. [00:39:00] So we've gotta look at like, what is your facility doing and how can we optimize that?

[00:39:07] Seth: Unfortunately, I wish, I wish there was a blanket that said, I wish I could tell you water at 10 times, 15 minutes apart. And that's works for every bit of weed, but unfortunately it's not that simple.

[00:39:18] Kaisha: That's so great, Seth. So yeah, just a reminder that like, the whole, the entire environment is what contributes to the, the dry back situation.

[00:39:25] Kaisha: You don't wanna start specifically with a dry back goal. Right,

[00:39:28] Seth: exactly. You know, and [00:39:30] a big thing growers are running into, you know, especially we've got, depending on how long you've been at this, if you first specked out your gross space five, six years ago, you're probably low on your, your de humidity capacity.

[00:39:42] Seth: It was that long ago. You might've switched from IDs to LEDs, so now you're extra low on your D capacity. Unfortunately, if you can't get your vpd up, there's no other tricks to help you crop steer if you're just, if it's too humid in there and you can't get the dry back, we [00:40:00] can't really do much, period. If we can only get an 8% dry back.

[00:40:04] Seth: I mean, and that's, that's aside from looking at mold and a bunch of other issues that can happen when your environment's not, you know, on point, but. . That's one thing I know that's really frustrating for growers is we'll run into these limitations that are, you know, hard, literally hardwired into the facility.

[00:40:20] Seth: So the, the intuition is always to like, what can I do to not have to change, solve the hardest problem or the most expensive one? And [00:40:30] unfortunately, that's just the reality in a lot of these spots. It's when you're, you know, like if we're talking about having to hit P three s overnight with the Hugos, like we were, like we were earlier, there's no strategy I can tell you that's gonna help you accomplish what you want to in those Hugos, you know, there's a fundamental flaw with what's going on there and we gotta correct that.

[00:40:53] Seth: Otherwise we're, we're gonna , you know, approach the same problem 10 different ways without, with 10 different non solutions [00:41:00] when we, you know, have a simple problem that just has an unfortunately expensive solution. It's right. It's

[00:41:07] Kaisha: about that big picture thinking. Awesome. Love that question. Thank you so much for your answers.

[00:41:12] Kaisha: Just a reminder, folks, anybody who's on with us live, we are coming, We got about what, just over 15 minutes left in the show, so be sure to type your question in the chat so we can get Seth's take on it. But Mikey posted just now he wrote for larger plants in generative stacking, How do you feel about a longer P one period versus a shorter P [00:41:30] one with a second saturation event at the end of the day, assuming that both result in a healthy, dry, back and end start of day water content.

[00:41:41] Seth: Gotcha. So when we do have a larger plant, you know, I mean that's the other side of this. I can, I can harsh on people for having big plants and small pots all day, but the reality is rarely is that on purpose, right? Generally speaking we're putting these in there. I mean, sometimes people will initially say, Oh, I'm gonna save some money.

[00:41:58] Seth: Smaller media. [00:42:00] But usually after one or two grows, you kind of are aware that there's a certain size you're going for and a lot of times stuff happens , you know, due to scheduling or whatever, they end up vegging for four more days than, you know. We plan for a multitude of reasons. The plans can get bigger.

[00:42:16] Seth: The main thing about it is we're still looking in that generative stacking for a short P one period, but when we're looking at it and saying, Okay, I'm gonna over dry, you know, by 10% tomorrow morning if I can't get a maintenance shot in the afternoon. What we [00:42:30] want to do is make sure our morning P one is as short as possible to hit field capacity.

[00:42:35] Seth: Then we're gonna ride it out until about two hours before lights off and add a maintenance shot, at least the amount that we want to correct in the morning. And. The reason for that, I guess is then we're still preserving that bigger dry bag. Now, sometimes we'll go back to the Hugos. I can spot those on a graph immediately every time they come up because typically you will be bringing it, have to [00:43:00] bring it back up to field capacity is how you know that's the amount you're gonna need to correct.

[00:43:04] Seth: It won't be a simple five or 8% shot. You'll be like, Well, by two hours before lights off, we're already at a 20% dry back . We need to get that back up so that we're not totally dry in the morning. So Maggie, I, I feel fine with that second day irrigation, but I also know that any time I go outside of that two hour irrigation window and anytime I add more events, then I'm putting less and less [00:43:30] generative stress on the plant.

[00:43:31] Seth: You know, I'll always use the old example of a three and a half gallon pot or a five gallon. With a three and a half to four foot tall plan in it. You watered that thing once every other day, maybe every third in the beginning. And that bud probably came out amazing. You know, it just never had the yield that we were looking for, cuz we had a small plant and a big pot.

[00:43:50] Seth: And we always had to wait for these, wait for days to get these dry backs, but side effect we're producing super crystally, high quality, [00:44:00] small buds, . That's kind of the result at the end of the day. Michael

[00:44:05] Kaisha: posted here with three to five harvests a week. Scheduling gets weird. Oh yeah,

[00:44:10] Seth: that's a lot. Yep.

[00:44:12] Seth: That's, that's the other thing too, right? Like, I think a lot of us got into cannabis cultivation for a lot of the right reasons. And a lot of the, you know, a lot of the same passions, like you start growing, you like it, the plants are fun. Interacting with plants is fun. Watching them grow is great. But the reality is, like [00:44:30] with Mike over there, hey, they've got a sizable facility.

[00:44:32] Seth: Three to five harvests a week is a lot of work. And it's important to make sure you find ways to do it where people don't burn out. You know, I think that's one of the hardest challenges about all this is most of us entered this out of, like I said, passion for the plant, passion for the craft. And at the end of the day, it's you gotta find some passion for, you know, small to medium, but size, business management, and humans.

[00:44:57] Seth: I think I, I had a customer [00:45:00] about a month ago, he said, Man, I, I didn't think I, I didn't take this job to manage people's emotions, but now that I've ironed out most of my growing challenges, that's what's left here is just keeping this place alive and making sure everyone here is happy enough to make sure we get all the things done that we need to do.

[00:45:18] Seth: Because, you know, once you start to hit size, you got 20, 30, 40, 50 plus employees. That's. That's a big ball to keep rolling. That's a lot more than just caring about the plans. [00:45:30]

[00:45:31] Kaisha: Mikey added here that he was a medical bed tenderer and a patient to patient grower long before corporate. You got some stories.

[00:45:38] Kaisha: Mikey . Yes, You've been in it. Thank you for your service. Awesome. Okay, we got a question here from Big Cifa. He told me to go ahead and ask for him. So can you speak on how much of a savings on water and nutrient saving you can expect with precision watering crop steering compared to a highly amended soilless soil [00:46:00] grow?

[00:46:00] Kaisha: And thoughts on that?

[00:46:01] Seth: You know, I would have to sit down and do some math, but typically speaking, you the better yield that you get out of, it's really gonna take over any kind of savings you have. But when we're looking at, you know, a soil, you know, a living soil grow for better or worse words We're looking at something that's fairly unregulated.

[00:46:20] Seth: So we're spending a lot of money typically. And that's the other thing too. It depends. Are you someone that is manufacturing, you know, living soil systems? Are you selling [00:46:30] the compost? Do you have that available? Because in the marketplace right now, if you can produce some of your old your own organic amendments and inputs, you do stand a chance.

[00:46:41] Seth: If you have to go buy all those. If you're buying compost aka cow poop from someone else to mix in, you might need to get into a situation where you you've got some cows and other inputs that you have access to for that. As far as water savings, though, massive amounts with precision irrigation.[00:47:00]

[00:47:00] Seth: I mean, what this allows us to do is run a higher ecuc, run it safer, and not rely on just hitting runoff every day in some attempt to maintain a consistent condition in the root zone.

[00:47:13] Kaisha: That's money saving. And I, at this point, resource saving, isn't it? Cause water is getting a little scarce in some parts of the country too, so. Oh,

[00:47:22] Seth: absolutely. Kish, you know, before I started working here, actually that was one of the main things I saw about this technology is I was familiar with meter [00:47:30] group's work and, you know, AROYA, agronomic research and stuff.

[00:47:33] Seth: I went, Wow, they're applying this to weed. That's awesome. You know, even back then I could see like, hey, we've got a pretty wasteful industry in the state it's in. And what a lot of, you know, just looking at the marketplace back then, there weren't that many tools available. You know, we are very limited in scope.

[00:47:51] Seth: And then the higher end of that selection, you know, I, it is hard, you know, it was hard to go to a legitimate scientific [00:48:00] instrument company and ask for tools for your weed . Not a lot of 'em really responded to all of that. You had to do the old tomatoes or, you know, , that, that whole thing. So, I think we're hitting an a point in time where you'll be able to see quite a big difference between people who are using sensor equipment and what their water usage is like, versus just reactionary making decisions and not sticking to a program.

[00:48:29] Seth: You know, [00:48:30] basically

[00:48:30] Kaisha: it's about those SOPs. Mikey wrote here, Initial costs for living soil is really high, and then Sifa attic. Got it. I'm in New Mexico and water is precious here. So precision watering seems to be a very viable option.

[00:48:44] Seth: Yeah, I think it's, it's gonna be necessary for longevity in this industry.

[00:48:48] Seth: You know, I mean, we can even look at Just other greenhouse crops in general, where that wasn't built into their initial , their initial plan when they're trying to build a facility and [00:49:00] suddenly, you know, I mean, we can look all over California. They're pulling down different types of orchards. Almonds are extremely water hungry, and so as cannabis, unfortunately.

[00:49:08] Seth: But you, you've, you've got a plan for that, especially if you're in an area where water is either expensive or, you know, not attainable. I definitely have talked to growers in the past who don't have, you know, they're remote and don't have access to a well or access to power at, So at a certain point, if you're using, you know, diesel to [00:49:30] haul water to your grow site and you're using diesel to haul diesel to your grow site, and eventually your overhead just gets to.

[00:49:37] Seth: Completely unreasonable. And if you're not making money, why are, why are you in this business? You know, I shouldn't say that cuz there's a lot of passion out there, but every business has to at least be able to maintain itself. Right? Like nothing lasts if it's just a total loss the whole time. And I can guarantee you it's gonna be quite a while before the government's willing to bail out any weed growers, [00:50:00] you know,

[00:50:01] Kaisha: facts on that one.

[00:50:02] Kaisha: Yeah. It's about sustainability on a, on a broader level for your business and for our environment. Mm-hmm. .

[00:50:08] Seth: Yeah. And that's the thing. Business and business and environmental sustainability are not at all mutually exclusive. I think that is a total myth out there that's just been propagated by people who are scared to do extra work and try to meet in the middle there.

[00:50:24] Seth: Love that. Yeah, it's,

[00:50:25] Kaisha: A couple of our attendees are bonding over the lack of water in their respective locations, . [00:50:30] So it's a sad reality, but I'm glad it's good to talk about. We have a few more minutes here. I wanna bring this question your way, Seth, because I don't think you were on the episode that we talked about this, but Drunk Nomad 40 Ounce asked about how to make your plant leaves pre or what causes them to, I wanted to just shout out that we covered that just a couple episodes ago.

[00:50:50] Kaisha: So, we're gonna post to it here in the chat and then also in our blog post. But anything you wanna add to that discussion, Seth?

[00:50:58] Seth: Yeah. So, you know, I think it was [00:51:00] last week or week before we, Jason started talking about trigger pressure. You know, what's involved with that? Basically how stiff those plant cell walls are based on, you know, the amount of water they have inside and the amount of water potential outside of the plant.

[00:51:13] Seth: That being said there again, that praying response is, that is a reaction to good environmental conditions. So basically what's going on there is as the plant pulls water in water, we have a certain amount of water inside the cells versus the cell wall. [00:51:30] Now the cell wall is hard, the cell membranes soft, so basically the cell actually lives inside this little shell.

[00:51:36] Seth: That cell swells and shrinks inside of there. The re the relationship between the amount of water inside the cell and the amount of suction coming from the environment is what causes parts of that to become more or less stiff. So if you've got high vpd in the morning sunlight and a reasonable temperature, you're gonna increase the cur pressure, which is basically [00:52:00] just how stiff those cell walls are because they have access to water now that it's being pulled up.

[00:52:05] Seth: And also when you increase that negative pressure on the plant, that's, you know, you're, you're pulling it up. The straw , the harder you suck on the straw, the more water comes up. Right. So that's the, that's the effect we're seeing there. The big thing I guess that's important with plants praying is if your plants aren't doing it, you need more Deus, you need to dry it out in there.

[00:52:27] Seth: And then also, you know, that's [00:52:30] not, that's totally skipping over the idea that maybe you also have Russ at Mites, Fure, Pithia, a whole range of diseases that can also cause poor plant performance. Yeah. You know, that's, don't, don't ever discount that in this, you know, that's, I know it's real easy to get hung up on, Hey, my plants look sick, it's nutrition, or it's definitely this or that.

[00:52:51] Seth: It's always holistic. I've definitely watched people just chase this problem, that problem, and then someone else comes in that hasn't been in their facility [00:53:00] before and says, Have you guys noticed these mites? And they go like, Oh, oh, rust bites. Alrighty. You know, and it's, it's just because they had, you know, been generally been having success with something for so long, and then a variable got kicked their way that they, you know, number one had never experienced before.

[00:53:17] Seth: And number two, they a lot of times had a bias where they had a problem in the past that was solved through nutrition or irrigation, but now this isn't the same problem. So, yeah, just remembering to step back and try to look at [00:53:30] everything as holistically as. . You know, if you, if you're having a problem and you're really struggling to solve it, there's a good chance you're just, you're kind of stuck in a box and you've gotta step outside of it, you know?

[00:53:42] Seth: And really remember, like, it's been difficult. There's a lot of research that's been done over the years, scientifically to come up with, like, why we stay inside of these parameters and values. That all came from experimentation and application. [00:54:00] We're not gonna solve anything overnight when it comes to plant health.

[00:54:04] Seth: And then, you know, remembering the, the farther you are into your run, the less of a difference. Anything you do, any change you make is gonna do. So as farmers, we've just always gotta be patient and go, Well, this one doesn't look the way I want it to. I'm gonna try my best, but I'm gonna look back and try to correct this on the next crop.

[00:54:25] Seth: That's where I'm gonna be able to make my big difference. [00:54:30]

[00:54:30] Kaisha: Wonderful. Thank you for that. All right, so we got just a couple more questions here. This was from over Get High. They asked AROYA sos terrace. 12 works great for home grow, right?

[00:54:44] Seth: Absolutely. . If you've got a little home grow going, go ahead.

[00:54:49] Seth: You know, my favorite thing to do with the terra or the so setup is if I've got, let's say 12 plants in there, I'll I'll check a few of 'em, right When I hydrate, if it's all the same strain, typically I'll [00:55:00] use that installation tool, actually install it in Sit U. That way I can just go in there, push the button, get my reading, and then walk out.

[00:55:09] Seth: Not spending time stabbing a plant every day. If I've got 12 of the same plant in there, and, you know, typically one in 80 to 120 plants is about a good sensor density. That our customers use. So if you're a home grower and you got that solace on one in 12, that's pretty good coverage. It's just up to you to go in there and like I [00:55:30] said before your P one shoot off and after your P one s shoot off, get that water content easy.

[00:55:39] Kaisha: Awesome. Thank you for that. You heard it? Home growers? I didn't use it for my home grow. I just had a couple of plants, but we'll see what happens next year. . All right. Mandy got a write in over there.

[00:55:50] Mandy: Yeah. Another quick one to ask Seth. So this week we got asked a question. Hi. Do you have any distributors in Europe for the SOS 12?

[00:55:57] Mandy: They might mean the Terrace 12, but SOS is what they wrote. [00:56:00] And does the SOS 12 work on the European Power Network at all? Do you have any advice for.

[00:56:07] Seth: I don't know if we have a specific European distributor. You could certainly send our sales or customer support and email. We can look into a little deeper on how to do that.

[00:56:14] Seth: I'm not in sales specifically, so I'm not, you know, super familiar with our distribution networks. I do know it is a goal to bring Oliver AROYA over to Europe eventually. However, right now, I mean there are a few challenges at first between different radio rules in between the US and, [00:56:30] and the eu. Those we've definitely been able to overcome hasn't been a big issue.

[00:56:35] Seth: Now. I think our biggest, our next hurdle in this also unfortunately affects you. Home growers out there is just sheer volume, you know, it's scaling up to me demand, and then dealing with the, the supply chain shortages. That's, that's been a huge challenge to us, just like anyone else manufacturing over the last few years, unfortunately.

[00:56:53] Seth: But we're, we're gonna get there. , we know there's demand and you know, Gear Up also has a. [00:57:00] It is a cool opportunity just because there's already so much greenhouse production and, you know, precision ag going on there in terms of horticulture in general. So we're, we're very excited to make it over there, especially as the cannabis market over there seems to be maturing.

[00:57:14] Seth: And you know, we're, we're getting away from the old Dutch style laws in places and moving more towards full legalization. Awesome. Well

[00:57:23] Mandy: that's good to hear. Really exciting stuff on in the works for Europeans and everyone beyond the us. Yeah, that's it. That's it [00:57:30] for YouTube. And the questions on my end.

[00:57:31] Mandy: Kaisha back

[00:57:32] Kaisha: over to you. Appreciate you Mandy. Thank you for co moderating with me. I think we're about to wrap it up. Seth, great job doing this solo. I do wanna address real quickly one write in that we got SMC Callie two, they were looking for some tutorials, so just wanna make sure everybody knows.

[00:57:48] Kaisha: Check out our, our resource page. We have. There, check out our YouTube, all of our videos are there. And then you know, if you don't see something on a specific topic or you want us to cover something on Office [00:58:00] Hours that shows for you, write to us and let us know. We do this every Thursday. So the, and the best way to get answers is just to come on live and ask the experts directly.

[00:58:08] Kaisha: You can also book a demo. We'd be happy to get one of our professionals out there and show you how AROYA can be used to improve your cultivation production process. But then, you know, feel free to send us a message in the chat. Shoot us an email at support.aroya@metergroup.com or send us a DM over Instagram with any topics, any questions that you have.

[00:58:28] Kaisha: We wanna hear from you. We record every [00:58:30] session. We're gonna email everyone in attendance and link to the video from today's conversation. It'll also be on the AROYA YouTube channel, like subscribe and share while you're there. And if you find these conversations us useful, please do spread the word.

[00:58:42] Kaisha: Thank you everybody to this week who joined us. We love. These, these live conversations, we live for it every week and we look forward to seeing you next time. Thanks everybody. Bye.